19-05-15 I am pretty versatile

[Artemisia]

as a person, or because "Angel can't decide what gender gonna be all the time?

As a person. I know several gender fluid people and don't really have an issue with them at all. I just can't stand this particular person.

[wiseguy]

taking aside that she sees Jerzy as her property (saying her as per how she is biologically) and no one can have him, and also that she sees Angel and Angie as 2 separate people and angel can have someone and Angie can have someone else................... she is not that bad actually

too bad she can't let go of Jerzy

Advantage Yuki(she in her way has let go of both Zii and Gary)

sometimes the mind is "interesting" to say the least

Bruce Jenner stated that he(he has not said yet to change gender ID or gotten a female name) saw self as a woman since childhood BUT has always being romantically attracted to women only, yet at same said that it is possible that when the sex change is done, he might consider going "heterosexual" (looking for men) and not lesbian(looking for women)

[Spidrift]

I actually like Angie versus Angel.

Angel has had some okay moments before this; those interactions with Ruby suggested someone who was no worse than cheerfully mischievous, for example. But that's just ignoring the elephant in the room; the possessive, jealous, downright creepy thing about Jerzy. And it's not really "Angie good, Angel bad", except in that we're more likely to see Angel interacting with Jerzy and Angie interacting with anyone else.

Which is a good reason to hope to see Ruby walk into the shop soon. She may suffer alittle confusion at first, but she'll presumably adapt to dealing with Angie - and I want to see how much she now sees herself as being on Team Dillon, and how Angie will relate to her.

[Artemisia]

taking aside that she sees Jerzy as her property (saying her as per how she is biologically) and no one can have him, and also that she sees Angel and Angie as 2 separate people and angel can have someone and Angie can have someone else................... she is not that bad actually

too bad she can't let go of Jerzy

Advantage Yuki(she in her way has let go of both Zii and Gary)

sometimes the mind is "interesting" to say the least

Bruce Jenner stated that he(he has not said yet to change gender ID or gotten a female name) saw self as a woman since childhood BUT has always being romantically attracted to women only, yet at same said that it is possible that when the sex change is done, he might consider going "heterosexual" (looking for men) and not lesbian(looking for women)

First of all, regarding Jenner, there is a lot of idiocy regarding sexuality among trans people. The reality is that the only people who flip sexualities tend to be in denial about their attraction to a particular sex. Some trans women I've known have gone from preferring men to preferring women because they were so feminine they actually did believe they were gay. That's very rare, though. Most of the time, the pressure to not only be male but straight causes many trans women to, before transition, marry/date women and after they've transitioned, they tend to find themselves dating men. The bulk of trans women I've known, though, have ended up staying with the sex they've always been attracted to.

With regards to Angel...It isn't just that Angel can't let go of Jerzy, but Angel seems determined to seduce anyone they can, cheat on Jerzy, and I honestly don't believe that Angel loves Jerzy. I actually do believe that, in a kind of obsessive way, that Yuki did love Zii. Angel tends to make me think of the kind of person who wants to own someone not out of love, but because they love possessing and hurting them. In fact, Angel seems sociopathic to me.

[Maechris]

There's apparently also some as-of-yet not fully understood mechanism in terms of attraction when it comes to one's own hormonal balance and the partner's pheromones (or some other stymuli). There's been an example of a "lesbian woman" (in terms of birth-sex, that is) who decided to have sex reassignment surgery to become a man, and after the change they became virtually homosexual (as in, only going for men). The reaction is not as strong in everyone, though, so nobody with a 'mission' should try to seek out and point that as some sort of "cure" for anybody's "wrong" sexuality.



As for Angel, it's clear that as long as Jerzy's not included in the equation (or anyone who had sexual contacts with Jerzy), they can be quite intelligent and composed as well as "regularly" social. However, there is some sort of a 'curious' vibe when you just fire off stuff about "intimacy" in front of a boy who seemed rather oblivious about the stuff some time ago.

[Artemisia]

There's a lot regarding gender and sexuality which is not well known. Not to mention the fact that there are a lot of trans people who are, at some level, intersexed. There are trans women who start HRT with lower testosterone than norm and a higher estrogen level than they should by average.

[JTheCreator]

When you say "trans woman" is that referring to pre or post op?

All this gender fluid and sexuality talk reminded me of an article I read on lesbian-men. Yes, it's a thing; not some line used to get in a girl's pants. There are guys out there who are 100% straight, yet feminine in some aspects, most of which are romantic or sexual. I can attest to this because if I had to, I'd use this label. I like it when a girl makes the first move in and out of bed, I like affection and being shown that I'm adored rather than told, and it would be great if someone asked me out versus the other way around. It just bites me a lot cause whenever I go out, the girls don't notice me but all the gay guys do.

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[Artemisia]

When I say "start HRT with" that usually means pre-op...in fact, pre-transition. I know one trans woman who started HRT with a testosterone level just barely above the minimum to be considered male and an estrogen level just below the norm for a woman.

[Azrael]

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[wiseguy]

There's a lot regarding gender and sexuality which is not well known. Not to mention the fact that there are a lot of trans people who are, at some level, intersexed. There are trans women who start HRT with lower testosterone than norm and a higher estrogen level than they should by average.

When you say "trans woman" is that referring to pre or post op?

All this gender fluid and sexuality talk reminded me of an article I read on lesbian-men. Yes, it's a thing; not some line used to get in a girl's pants. There are guys out there who are 100% straight, yet feminine in some aspects, most of which are romantic or sexual. I can attest to this because if I had to, I'd use this label. I like it when a girl makes the first move in and out of bed, I like affection and being shown that I'm adored rather than told, and it would be great if someone asked me out versus the other way around. It just bites me a lot cause whenever I go out, the girls don't notice me but all the gay guys do.

So technically i can be seen as a lesbian male? I feel comfortable being a male and I am attracted to girls, I feel more comfortable talking things with girls than with guys, I prefer romances and I love usually chick flicks, I tend to be more emotional (but I also usually stay calm in critical situations), I love writing(but I like to find generally how thing works also), I love Tinker Bell and I usually am emphatic of how others feel but I also got small mix of "male values", I loved playing with toy cars as a kid, loved playing cowboys and indians, always loved ALL sports(or most of them)

[JTheCreator]

Wiseguy, basically yeah you could fall into that category. I'm guilty of some of the things you mentioned. I've always felt more comfortable around girls, which is ironic, because until the past few years I was petrified to talk to them hahaha.

[Gholateg]

I am... Confused.

Is Angel intentionally treating their genders as separate individuals, or is this just an excuse to do the date without it being cheating?

From what I understand of gender fluid, you're still you, just presenting as one gender depending on whatever you're feeling at the moment. Either wearing a dress or a pair of slacks, you're still the same person.
Compartmentalizing into a separate identity feels like something other then gender fluid. Which, given what we know of Angel...

Honestly makes a hell of a lot more sense then just being gender fluid.

[wiseguy]

different people, different things I guess

right now going by "biologically girls"

some girls feel sometimes like wearing masculine clothes and sometimes feminine clothes, but they feel the same person, and always see themselves as girls

other girls do not give importance to what they wear, but some days they feel like behaving with a masculine attitude even if they wear a dress, sometimes like a feminine attitude even if they wear a men suit but still see themselves as girls no matter what

some girls actually when they become male attitude, they see themselves as boys yet same person

some girls actually change personality and at same time change sexual preference!!!!!!!! as girls, they feel attracted to guys, but as boys, they find themselves attracted to girls ................ in much smaller cases we have the girl=lesbian/boy=gay syndrome

if Angel is truthful................. she sees and feels as different persons with each genderfluid change even if both "Angel" and "Angie" are attracted to boys

sees Angel as gay, and sees Angie as heterosexual

so Angel might have both "gender-fluid" and some kind of split personality

as I have said many times in the past, looks like both Jerzy and Angel are very complicated

[Spidrift]

Is Angel intentionally treating their genders as separate individuals, or is this just an excuse to do the date without it being cheating?

To be fair, I didn't think that Angel was being that serious about the "excuse to date two people" thing. It was actually Jacob came up with it, and Angel rolled her eyes and looked amused. She's saying that she'll present as male or female according to what her current partner prefers, because she wants to satisfy them and keep them happy, but she's said that the date with Richie can't get too serious, it's just a "reward date" - which I interpret as "will go out for a drink and allow a goodnight kiss, but sex isn't on the agenda".

Which is ethically borderline, partly depending on what she tells Jerzy, but isn't the same as running two simultaneous sexual relationships. Jacob suggesting that it's okay because there are two Angels is just Jacob being an uncomprehending kid.

[JoybuzzerX]

That was my take on it to. Angel just giving an excuse to get Jacob the job back.

Tho, I do think before she got back with Jerzy, she may have had an eye on Ritchie.

I think we'll find Angel is probably pretty faithful to Jerzy and it'll be Jerzy who really cheats on Angel if they're officially dating.

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