07-04-15 I have peeked at a few shows myself

[JoybuzzerX]

So, Zii snaps a shot of two men together without them knowing, then decides to share it with others. Zii is the creepy!

[Spidrift]

We knew that Zii had an iffy habit like that -- but what makes you think that the guys didn't know? The times we've seen her exercising this hobby, she was more or less upfront about it. I'm not saying that the guys consented, but it's hard to get a shot like that completely surreptitiously. The fact that she's apparently never had to go to hospital to have the camera recovered suggests that she picks tolerant victims.

(And she's still some way behind Dillon, who has a large collection of prints of men he more or less stalked, and a bunch of digital images of Andy's butt and pecs. Now, if Ruby ever finds out about Dillon's collection, will her integrity make her call him on it, or will her libido make her demand copies?)

[JoybuzzerX]

I never said there weren't any just as bad.

However, she did say "I sneaked a few myself" right before showing the picture, which would imply there was no consent, but rather, like Ruby she was hiding from them.

We've also seen Zii try to do such acts to Gary without his consent. The difference is, now it sounds like she's not just keeping them for her own private collection but is more than willing to share them freely with anyone.

Quote removed. The DAMNed

[Spidrift]

She sneaked the shot of Gary and Dillon in the strip I linked to. They still knew it'd happened afterwards, though.

I wouldn't assume that she shows her collection to just anyone, if only because she's probably kind of possessive. (But also because she'd recognise that that would be more likely to lead to trouble.) She's establishing a rapport with Ruby here, in her Zii-ish way, and that may involve a little bit of trust and sharing on her own side.

Oh dear. Coffee shop scene. Trust and sharing. Completely wrong image going through my head.

Hmm. Zii is looking smart and in control in this scene, which should mostly be okay, because it's about Ruby reviewing her ideas with Zii's help. Still, I kind of hope that Ruby might land a few jabs herself in the course of the conversation. ("How's the virginity lifestyle working out for you?" "Well, I've got my BBA. How's the casual sex lifestyle working out for you?")

[Bambikles]

I also like how Minew has been given her own speech bubble font.

Minew is a girl ?

[Spidrift]

No, he's a cat.

(Sorry about that.)

[Azrael]

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[themacnut]

So, Zii snaps a shot of two men together without them knowing, then decides to share it with others. Zii is the creepy!

Now, now JoybuzzerX, women can't be creepy, only men can be creepy. Women are just...okay I can't keep typing this with a straight face.

Yes, Zii is creepy as hell with those pictures. But because she's a woman, and a short skinny one at that, her actions are less likely to be considered threatening by those subjected to her obsession.

[JoybuzzerX]

Kinda my point. If that was Gary or Matt doing that with pictures of women, I can only think the forum goers would have a different opinion on it.

Quote removed. The DAMNed

[Spidrift]

You assume that "the forum goers" approve of Zii's behaviour. Well, despite the fact that "the forum goers" are actually about as capable of agreeing on anything as a bag of cats, I haven't seen anybody here defending Zii's little hobby or saying that she's cool to do that. There's just been a bit of eye-rolling. If the strip failed to cause some kind of shitstorm, remember that this is an old story with Zii, and we've been round this a good few times on the Ma3 boards. Even the posters here can see when a topic has been done to death. Eventually. Most of them.

Sorry if you've seen less righteous anger to agree with than you'd like, but as tmn says, while Zii's behaviour is actually creepy as hell, a petite woman going round spying on men is just less physically threatening than a man doing the same to women. "Creepy" just makes people less angry than "creepy and fucking scary".

If anybody comes out of this strip looking slightly worse than before, really, it's Ruby. If she was thinking straight, she'd see that the picture she's just purchased was probably acquired by morally dubious means - and she's normally got high moral standards. But she's not thinking straight, so she gets a pass.

[tanonev]

Still, I kind of hope that Ruby might land a few jabs herself in the course of the conversation. ("How's the virginity lifestyle working out for you?" "Well, I've got my BBA. How's the casual sex lifestyle working out for you?")

She got her BBA apparently without having interned anywhere, without having networked, without looking into grad school, without having even started her job search, and she isn't being headhunted. If that is ALL she got out of trading her sex drive for academic drive, she didn't have much of either to begin with. Given her portrayal as being quicker on the uptake than that when she isn't distracted/distressed, I prefer the more favorable explanation that her sexual repression actually negatively affected her academic/professional performance during her university years, even if she didn't realize it (i.e., spending too much energy on appearing "respectable" instead of just going out and doing what she's good at, and earning real respect in the process).

[Spidrift]

You may well be right. Though to be honest, I'm not sure if this is a particularly realistic depiction of a reasonably competent business studies graduate and her career arc. (If Ruby is academically passably bright but not very socially adept, should she even have gone into business studies at all, rather than something a bit less ... customer-facing?) Then again, I'm kind of out of touch with what would be a realistic depiction.

I dunno... Ruby is obviously someone who's got problems, and I wouldn't recommend her emotional choices to anyone. (Sacrificing social life for career, at least for a few years, could be a valid decision, but like you say, you need to make sure that you get a good exchange rate on the deal.) But in theory, no one in this comic is supposed to have all the answers. And yet, Dillon seems to have got his head quite a lot straighter after one or two conversations with Ruby, Amber has had a hot nice-guy boyfriend literally fall into her lap, and now Zii, guest-starring, is in some danger of having her helpful objectivity turn into smug omniscience if the writers aren't careful - leaving Ruby as the clueless butt monkey yet again, unless she can push back a bit against all these people telling her what she's doing wrong.

She probably needs to unleash Rudy again sometime soon. Which, given that it's only a couple of days, comics time, since his last appearance, could turn her into some kind of weirdly habitual transvestite, but hey, whatever floats her boat. (Actually, of course, she needs to learn how to unleash Rudy while still being dressed as Ruby. But, baby steps.)

[Ecchi-Spud]

Minew and Lita should get together to talk about their humans' interests.

"Minew?" "Myaoi!"

[brasca]

If anybody comes out of this strip looking slightly worse than before, really, it's Ruby. If she was thinking straight, she'd see that the picture she's just purchased was probably acquired by morally dubious means - and she's normally got high moral standards. But she's not thinking straight, so she gets a pass.

Is that what she's purchasing? I thought "how much do you want for this" was the realization her guilty pleasure is known and there is no way of denying it so she is asking how much it will cost to keep Zii quiet. Taking pictures like this is one of Zii's and for that matter Dillon's less than endearing qualities so I really don't want her to use moral relativism to convince Ruby that there is nothing wrong with this. Maybe there was some subconscious desire or instinct to hide in the closet when Dillon and Jerzy were about to enter her room, but whereas Ruby feels guilty about getting a free yaoi show Zii would not if she were in her place.

This is all supposed to be lighthearted, but I do wonder if there is more to this than respectability. There is an unfair double standard for women who enjoy the same kinds of pleasures men do and knowing that might be another justification for Ruby's repression. While I doubt the LaRose's would be any happier if they discovered their son was doing pornography society would not take as nearly a dim view if Amber was a man trying to get into legitimate acting.

This conversation takes place a few days before Zii's ill-fated clubbing with Gary and Yvan so it's possible Ruby made an impression on her. Ultimately she helped Gary out because of friendship, but there might have been some resemblance of guilt that aside from good looks, youth, and charm she has tendencies that make her too similar to someone like Yvan.

[FlashD81]

(funny I thought I replied on this one already)

Well there is not much I can add that has not already been mentioned, I'm enjoying the this new budding friendship.