29-07-14 28 is lucky

Discuss SDB here!

Moderators: Shouri, Giz

Post Reply
User avatar
Zippy
Posts: 1079
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:15 am

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Zippy »

TCampbell wrote:Blame me if you like for this particular callback to one of Dillon's early defining moments. It was my suggestion and I pushed for it. And I stand by it, though it may be a year or more before I know for sure whether it was the right call.
The thing is... Giz said above that:
Giz wrote:I can understand why someone would hate him, but if he was perfect, he'd be boring as hell....Both these characters need to grow.
This just highlights that he hasn't grown AT ALL in over five years, including a year of his own strip. If anything, he's got worse.

User avatar
Artemisia
Mistress of Oddities
Posts: 12513
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:46 pm
Location: Deep in the mountains where the elves roam.

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Artemisia »

However, from his perspective, it's been one year. That's right, please remember that while we are up to six volumes of Ma3 only a year has passed since Matt and Dillon were doing Reverse Cowgirl on Gary's drawing table.
Avatar thanks to Saikoh
"I'm going to do what I do best...lecture her."- Twilight Sparkle (My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic)
"Hello, I'm a lizard woman from the dawn of time, and this is my wife." - Madam Vastra (Doctor Who "The Snowmen")
"There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes." The 4th Doctor Doctor Who "Robot"

User avatar
Giz
Site Admin
Posts: 3854
Joined: Sat May 10, 2008 3:32 am

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Giz »

It hasn't been a full year in Ma3 time since the very beginning. Half a year and a smidge perhaps? Haven't kept track too closely, but I know for sure we're not in Summer now and it was Summer (in strip) when Ma3 started. In SDB... a couple of weeks?

User avatar
Artemisia
Mistress of Oddities
Posts: 12513
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:46 pm
Location: Deep in the mountains where the elves roam.

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Artemisia »

I was counting from Gary's birth day and figured that he had just turned 29 when Ma3 started. Of course, that could easily be wrong. I had thought I remember Zii saying something about having a year to get Gary laid. Oh well. Yeah, it hasn't been overly long since the series started in any case.
Avatar thanks to Saikoh
"I'm going to do what I do best...lecture her."- Twilight Sparkle (My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic)
"Hello, I'm a lizard woman from the dawn of time, and this is my wife." - Madam Vastra (Doctor Who "The Snowmen")
"There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes." The 4th Doctor Doctor Who "Robot"

User avatar
Cortez
Posts: 2419
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:53 am

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Cortez »

Giz wrote:I can understand why someone would hate him, but if he was perfect, he'd be boring as hell. Removing him (from his own series) would not help the series. Ruby needs a Dillon-type for her comedy to come out. The goal here is just like TheDude said. Both these characters need to grow.
Most certainly, but it is also easy to see how the hypocrisy of his situation rubs some people the wrong way. But obviously that seems to be the point.

This arc could even end with Dillon learning some self awareness. After all, he has made an effort to move on from his crush from Gary(Or at least that seems to be the case since he hasn't made a move on him in awhile), so credit where it's due.
Artemisia wrote: We each have our favorite characters. I have to be honest that part of why I don't read SOTR regularly is because I am not a fan of Sandra or Senna. I'm looking into it a bit more now, but they were not and aren't my favorite characters in Ma3.
Zoe, Cammi, Marie and Lavali are awesome though.

Sandra too, but i respect that you don't like her.
Last edited by Cortez on Tue Jul 29, 2014 9:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Fluffy
Posts: 3603
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2011 7:14 pm

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Fluffy »

Eehh...but now that Jerzy is out of his life (for the time being, anyway), I could see Dillon trying to seek comfort from Gary; only to find out that his BFF has hooked up with him, despite his wishes that she stay away from him.

AS a side note - I see Dillon as one of those soap opera characters that you love to hate; the one you hope will either have some redeeming qualities that will make them likeable or one who will have reality thrown into their faces, like a cold bucket of water.

So, as often as I roll my eyes/am disgusted at Dillon's selfish/hypocritical antics, I continue reading because - despite it all - I do enjoy this series and continue to read in the hopes that, one day, Dillon will come to realize that he isn't perfect/blameless.
Please, don't come to me expecting me to fix your problems.

User avatar
Spidrift
Posts: 13180
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:11 pm

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Spidrift »

brasca wrote:It's the hypocrisy.
Bingo. Many readers seem to have a very strong and maybe slightly irrational special hatred of hypocrisy. Most of the characters in this comic universe have their full share of flaws, but hypocrisy is actually quite rare, and always seems to trigger an extreme reaction when it crops up.

Zii maybe came close with her "pimping me out" speech to Gary, but if he'd argued the point with her, she could have finessed the issue with quibbles about levels of consent and responsibility in her own shenanigans. Even so, that strip caused a fair amount of flamage on the boards. The character who seemed most deeply hypocritical was Nathan, and he's seen as one of the comics' few downright slimy villains - although actually, he may just be as self-deluded and impulse-driven as ... Dillon.

Talking of whom, different people probably have different exacerbating issues with Dillon. Some think that his treatment of Gary was borderline creepy or just plain bullying (and he may also be seen as bullying Ruby). Others just find his flamboyant campness irritating. He's certainly vain.

And on top of it all, he can seem like a creators' pet. The writers have said that they like him, and sometimes it seems that all the other characters have to agree with them. Everyone likes him and thinks that he's cute and doesn't want him to change; even the characters who he should annoy mostly put up with him. Jerzy pretty well fell in love at first sight. It was necessary to introduce a completely new character, with a completely different personality type to all the other characters in the comics, just to get someone who could call Dillon out on his BS.

Me, well, I'm another person who'll say that they don't hate Dillon, and try and keep a straight face in the process. But I do find his camp drama queen style deeply irritating rather than cute, so you won't find me liking him. That's a matter of personal taste, obviously, but it's hardly a unique taste, I think.
TCampbell wrote:Blame me if you like for this particular callback to one of Dillon's early defining moments. It was my suggestion and I pushed for it. And I stand by it, though it may be a year or more before I know for sure whether it was the right call.
I'd say that it was a brave decision (Prime Minister). Some of us remembered that early boast, but even without liking Dillon, we could be prepared to regard it as a figure of speech or a bit of early-issue flamboyance. This strip not only brings the subject up again, it confirms that yes, the worst readings were justified; Dillon really is a deluded hypocrite. That's a lot of audience tolerance to sacrifice, just to confirm that Dillon has flaws.
TCampbell wrote:I wanted it as clear as we could make it that this has never been a story about poor repressed Ruby who just needs to lighten up and learn from the Zen master Dillon, who has everything figured out. That's the story Dillon often thinks he's in, right now, and sometimes it's appeared that way to the reader, too.
I never really saw the story that way, but then I always found Dillon irritating while having a lot of sympathy for Ruby (for entirely personal reasons I'll always acknowledge). What I did suspect sometimes was that the writers were a little too attached to Dillon, so while they couldn't deny that they'd written him with flaws, they maybe found those flaws "cute". Conversely, Ruby is repressed and easily embarrassed, which means that if any strip needs an easy gag, "let's embarrass Ruby some more" is usually the first answer to hand. The first gets irritating to people who don't like Dillon, the second is lazy and seems like cheap piss-on-the-nerds humour to those who like Ruby. If Ruby can actually organise her anger into a coherent reaction here, and give Dillon some of the verbal kicking he deserves, that brave decision may achieve something.
---------
Spidrift
"Brevior vita est quam pro futumentibus negotium agendo."
-- Motto of Hogshead Publishing of fond memory, and wise words to set your Foes List by.
Avatar misappropriated from the wonderful XKCD.

Odd Man Out
Posts: 747
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 12:35 am

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Odd Man Out »

I just find Dillon boring as a character. What most bores me is that every time he seems to actually change there's a quick reversion to the status quo, at least in terms of his thoughts/beliefs. Sure, if he were a person the flaws would lead me to never associate with him once they became apparent but that's a very different issue. Clearly he has enough fans or at least audience investment to carry the spin off so some people are getting more out of him than I am. Ruby and Amber interest me enough to stay around by being in the same tribe for one and a curious mix of pragmatism and naivete for the other.

User avatar
Artemisia
Mistress of Oddities
Posts: 12513
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:46 pm
Location: Deep in the mountains where the elves roam.

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Artemisia »

Cortez wrote:
Artemisia wrote: We each have our favorite characters. I have to be honest that part of why I don't read SOTR regularly is because I am not a fan of Sandra or Senna. I'm looking into it a bit more now, but they were not and aren't my favorite characters in Ma3.
Zoe, Cammi, Marie and Lavali are awesome though.

Sandra too, but i respect that you don't like her.
Sandra annoyed me because I've known a few people like she was back in the early days of Ma3. I've known a few too many women who relied on alcohol to give them "confidence" in social situations, and bad things happened to them. I decided to buy the SOTR book and I'll read through it when it arrives to see how I feel at that point.
Avatar thanks to Saikoh
"I'm going to do what I do best...lecture her."- Twilight Sparkle (My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic)
"Hello, I'm a lizard woman from the dawn of time, and this is my wife." - Madam Vastra (Doctor Who "The Snowmen")
"There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes." The 4th Doctor Doctor Who "Robot"

crimzontearz
Posts: 773
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 11:48 am

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by crimzontearz »

Artemisia wrote:crimsontearz,

When you dismiss the fact that these things exist in our society you tacitly give it permission to exist. I do agree with you with regards how people are what they are. I also agree that it is wrong for Dillon to act in a hypocritical manner regarding cheating, but that is part of his character and part of the humor of him.

But, since you do not want to debate, that's fine.
you would be surprised how hard it is to debate on a cell phone while waiting in an INS office


anyway, Those things I dismiss exist, I do not give them permission to exist, they do whether I bemoan their existence or simply ignore it and let is slide off the inclined plane of my indifference. They will continue to exist until the human race wakes the hell up and grows up but until then it is up to those under said pressure to have the fortitude to push through it. I sympathize with others' struggles, but I do not justify weakness.

suranae
Posts: 472
Joined: Thu May 30, 2013 2:31 am

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by suranae »

But without weakness one cannot appreciate strength. Nor can one be strong all the time.

crimzontearz
Posts: 773
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 11:48 am

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by crimzontearz »

and without strength one is trapped in its own weakness. Life is made of priorities, it up to you to decide what is worth being strong for and if the consequences of being weak are more dire than the consequences of being strong. Afterward, if one willfully chooses to be weak in this aspect of life what does that say about that individual?

Abraxas
Posts: 374
Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 2:39 pm

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by Abraxas »

Dillon having flaws is fine. I agree a character needs flaws

Him being so egocentricly vain that he believes the sun only rises cause he gets up to greet it, works for comedic effect

The issue here is... okay you've established just how outright loathsome he actually is, This is Matt admitting 'that he is a bastard' while he has a threesome after failing to make up with Dillon the person he has wronged and having done so with Sandra right there. Retroactively you've annihilated any of dillon's sympathetic qualities cause, this repaints all the time Dillon bemoaned being hurt... cause he is no better then Matt

This isn't being treated as "Dillon you're a Narcissitic overbearing Asshole, grow the **** up" - followed by knee to groin and possibly ass kicking that leads Dillon to have a self awareness check -Ruby do it next issue, you can do it!-... It's Dillon is so oblivious to his own flaws, that he is missing the point... and will continue to do so. Dillon is stagnant and honestly there is no real reason to stick with him. I mean people will stay for ruby and lords knows when Amber will get something to do. Why should I care if Dillon becomes self aware and confront his flaws other then "He is the main character so you're stuck with him"

Yeah Dillon has flaws...however he starting to feel less like a Character with mostly Positive Qualities and few Negative flaws to the reverse, He is Mostly Negative Qualities and a few positive flaws.
and that looks like thats not gonna change anytime soon. So he isn't boring, he is just down right aggravating.

User avatar
FlashD81
Posts: 1217
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:40 am
Location: Not the Normanday

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by FlashD81 »

Yep, that right there kind of sums it up. Still there is a glimmer of hope, Ruby.

What I see going on is all the "lessons" he gives Ruby is giving her a voice. She will hopefully use this voice to break through to Dillon and make him more self-aware. She will be embarrassed and stressed by him but the feedback she gives has to break through eventually. Otherwise why should I bother to care?

Help me Ruby, you're my only hope.
I'm Commander Shepard and this is my favorite store on the Citadel
We'll Bang, OK

User avatar
ThePonyGuy
Posts: 253
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 8:11 am

Re: 29-07-14 28 is lucky

Post by ThePonyGuy »

Cortez wrote:Yeah, Matt cheating on Dillon is starting to look like karma catching up to Dillon. Matt is still in the wrong obviously, but Dillon can't complain much since he's been in the "mistress" role.
It's actually less mystical and poorly interpretted than that.

Simply put: We attract our own. The reason why Dillon attracts guys that cheat is because he's perfectly willing to encourage it if he's not the one on which the guys are cheating. Were it that he was the kind of person that was intolerant to cheating at all, he might not run into it so much in his partners. That's not to say that he'd never end up dating a guy that cheated on him, just that it would be rather rare.

Post Reply