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Fluffy wrote:Great - just what we need; an excuse for Dillon to keeps mums and continue with his selfish duplicity.

Except that, for Dillon to take really full advantage of this, he'd have to admit to being gay himself. "I'll force myself to help you" would only go so far - especially with Ruby around to act as Dillon's conscience. And then, Ray might react a lot of different ways.

Basically, the situation is currently comedy chaos which could jump any which way over the next few strips.

FlashD81 wrote:Aside from that I hope Ruby will help them both out. Keep Dillon from sliding back, and help Ray figure out his feelings. I say hope because her feelings on wanting some more hot-guy-on-guy action might override her ability to reason.

They might, but the evidence so far is that Ruby's conscience consistently overrules her emotions, albeit that she's now discovering that she has strong feelings. Her super-ego has been ruling her id for years now; that surely won't change overnight.

brasca wrote:

Spidrift wrote:Not many girlfriends, confused by his feelings after his first kiss from another guy... Looks to me like Kinsey-greater-than-zero with a large overlay of repression. Where his real inclinations lie remains to be seen.

Could be or he might be yet another character too dimwitted to know his own sexuality. I should hope not since this strip already has Andy and then there is Sonya at Menage a 3.

"Too dimwitted to know" is really just another way of saying "repressed".

I can see the resemblance to Sonya, but current evidence is that Andy is straight, and is actually quite clear about that. He just suffers from a bizarre tendency to hero-worship Dillon. (Could he actually be a piss-take on the sort of Dillon fans who show up at conventions?)

I can see Ray as possibly a male counterpart to Sonya, though, but with the gender difference making a difference to the way this expresses itself. Sonya is a girly-girl who thinks that being lesbian or bi would undermine her femininity, of which she's rather proud. Ray seems to be a classic (if fairly amiable) jock, who assumes that his sort of straightforward, sporty guy must be straightforwardly ... straight.

Spidrift wrote:

FlashD81 wrote:Aside from that I hope Ruby will help them both out. Keep Dillon from sliding back, and help Ray figure out his feelings. I say hope because her feelings on wanting some more hot-guy-on-guy action might override her ability to reason.

They might, but the evidence so far is that Ruby's conscience consistently overrules her emotions, albeit that she's now discovering that she has strong feelings. Her super-ego has been ruling her id for years now; that surely won't change overnight.

It doesn't necessarily need to change completely. For instance, if she needed to take any kind of action for her Id to "win," I would expect her superego to get the better of her. But she might be tempted to let things spin out of control by not doing anything at all. Indeed, her new moral conflict might lend itself to that; she could be legitimately torn on what to do, if anything, long enough for everything to boil over on its own.
Besides, think of how many expressions she can make just watching these two flail at each other. Minew can get involved too.

Spidrift wrote:

brasca wrote:

Spidrift wrote:Not many girlfriends, confused by his feelings after his first kiss from another guy... Looks to me like Kinsey-greater-than-zero with a large overlay of repression. Where his real inclinations lie remains to be seen.

Could be or he might be yet another character too dimwitted to know his own sexuality. I should hope not since this strip already has Andy and then there is Sonya at Menage a 3.

"Too dimwitted to know" is really just another way of saying "repressed".

I can see the resemblance to Sonya, but current evidence is that Andy is straight, and is actually quite clear about that. He just suffers from a bizarre tendency to hero-worship Dillon. (Could he actually be a piss-take on the sort of Dillon fans who show up at conventions?)

I can see Ray as possibly a male counterpart to Sonya, though, but with the gender difference making a difference to the way this expresses itself. Sonya is a girly-girl who thinks that being lesbian or bi would undermine her femininity, of which she's rather proud. Ray seems to be a classic (if fairly amiable) jock, who assumes that his sort of straightforward , sporty guy must be straightforwardly ... straight.

I'm not sure this analysis goes far enough. By all accounts, Dillon is not just gay, but GAY, practically his own pride parade level of stereotypical. And Ray doesn't register it. It would be one thing if they had been distantly, but constantly, in touch for all these years, like Gary was, since gradual shifts in behavior and expression are easy to miss. But this is the first time Ray and Dillon have seen each other in quite some time, surely something should have lit up his little brain bulbs. But he's apparently clueless. Which indicates, to me, a level of denial and repression that envelops his companions as well as himself.
The level of self-delusion necessary for an actor to simply not see gay in the world until just now is awe-inspiring, but this comic is full of people with similar levels of self-delusion. Which is why Ruby in ass-kicking mode is such a joy to behold.

Ray missing Dillon's flaming gayness does seem a little clueless, but, well, they've only been hanging out together for an hour or two. And Ray came in thinking of Dillon as the regular-guy friend that he knew at school, while Dillon may have been reflexively repressing his usual camp mannerisms as he fell back into school-style behaviour patterns around Ray.

In other words - comedically clueless, maybe, but perhaps not grossly implausible.

Oh dear, I've just thought of another way this scene could go. Dillon falls silent in confusion, which Ray interprets as a straight guy being shocked to discover that his old friend may be gay. Meanwhile, Ruby turns pragmatically helpful and offers some sensible open-minded advice, which Ray accepts but treats as a sign that Ruby must be plugged into the gay scene herself. And hey, Ruby goes for short hair, minimal makeup, and flat-heeled shoes. So Ray decides that the reason that lady's man Dillon isn't boffing Ruby must be that Ruby is a lesbian...

(Longer term thought: Will this comic run long enough to show Dillon and Amber achieving success and renown as actors? Because, come that day, their personal traits will be discussed by every gossip rag in Canada.)

FlashD81 wrote:<backs away slowly> K-Kate calm down. Dillon still has to admit he is Gay, and Ray as to accept that he may be bi. <keeps distance> Besides I'm sure Ruby wants to see them make out as much as anyone else.

I'll tell you when I've had enough!!!!

Huh. This one is quite good.

Well, Dillon, you're getting better at this then

I like this development, and yeah...I actually would like to see that Ray is bi

@ Art I can't remember when exactly but I have felt that Ray being Bi has been a possibility for a long time now.

I think it was probably the moment he was introduced

Which would make him the first officially and totally bi male character in the serieses I believe.

he might be the only(so far) regular character that is "totally bi" but some would argue Jerzee WAS(but decided to go boys only and us not sure what Angel is), and he is not a regular, but Matt is Bi

Nathan likes boys and is married and has been with Amber

we never got indications about Ricky

FlashD81 wrote:@ Art I can't remember when exactly but I have felt that Ray being Bi has been a possibility for a long time now.

He's an Ma3 universe character; of course people thought he might be bi. The only actual evidence was his slightly ambiguous manner around Dillon, and the fact that he admitted to having few or no girlfriends, despite being a good-looking guy in professional sports.

Of course, there was also only a little evidence for him being straight - mostly the way he looked at Amber, and sounded so impressed about Dillon knowing and living with her and her sister. But until this strip, that and the basic law of averages said "probably straight (and shy)" to me. Now, my money would be on "represed bi". But we really don't know anything for certain. Running ahead of the evidence is a bit silly.

Incidentally, someone over on the TV Tropes boards just threw out another possibility; that Ray is practising some improv acting. Or, I guess, he could be getting some revenge for the "jokes" that he thought Dillon pulled on him.

Unlikely on balance, I feel, but it'd be a torturous twist for Dillon.

Double post merged. The DAMNed

Spidrift wrote:

FlashD81 wrote:@ Art I can't remember when exactly but I have felt that Ray being Bi has been a possibility for a long time now.

He's an Ma3 universe character; of course people thought he might be bi. The only actual evidence was his slightly ambiguous manner around Dillon, and the fact that he admitted to having few or no girlfriends, despite being a good-looking guy in professional sports.

Of course, there was also only a little evidence for him being straight - mostly the way he looked at Amber, and sounded so impressed about Dillon knowing and living with her and her sister. But until this strip, that and the basic law of averages said "probably straight (and shy)" to me. Now, my money would be on "represed bi". But we really don't know anything for certain. Running ahead of the evidence is a bit silly.

We'll find out fairly soon...it would just be kind of nice to have a male character who is confirmed bisexual like it would be nice to have a confirmed lesbian character...but that's me own preferences...it's up to the writers on this one

Spidrift wrote:Incidentally, someone over on the TV Tropes boards just threw out another possibility; that Ray is practising some improv acting. Or, I guess, he could be getting some revenge for the "jokes" that he thought Dillon pulled on him.

Unlikely on balance, I feel, but it'd be a torturous twist for Dillon.

That would be INCREADBLY mean of him if that were true. For the most part (as you have pointed out in the past) what we see is what we get in the Ma3 verse.

With that in mind Ray is genuinely confused about his sexual preference.

@Artemisia If this series keeps going on the way it has been you might get your wish.

I don't think that Ray would do such a thing to Dillon since he seems very friendly towards Dillion.

And I certainly would love that FlashD

FlashD81 wrote:[That would be INCREADBLY mean of him if that were true.

But remember, that's exactly the sort of joke that Ray thinks Dillon has pulled on him once or twice - and he doesn't know how much it would hurt Dillon. For Ray, it'd just seem like some ordinary straight-guy joshing and good acting practice.

I don't actually buy it, on balance, but I wouldn't rule it out.

So did Dillon use the SGR on Ray?