08-04-13 My perfect big sister

[vampire hunter D]

You know, she didn't need to watch a video to see Amber's fanny (regardless of whether that refers to the butt or vajayjay). Amber posed for stillshots too (gary had one as a poster if you remember). Someone may have must showed her a'pic or two out of Hustler or Penthouse

[Spidrift]

I really, really hope she doesn't turn out to be asexual, though. That kind of attitude... I don't think I've met an asexual with that attitude. I'm sure there are some, but it seems like the kind of attitude that could be some sort of negative association in the mind of a writer.

I doubt that she's full-on asexual; her attitude so far looks much more like a mixture of "business first" and some kind of reaction to her big sister's behaviour. But it's perfectly possible that she just has a relatively low sex drive. Frankly, in the Ma3 universe, someone with a normal, realistic level of interest in the subject, and other stuff to do with their time, is going to look virtually asexual. Her line in panel 1 is really quite funny in that setting, from the readers' point of view.

I'll guess that she'll eventually gain some kind of romantic interest, somewhere in the comic's run. (I kind of hope so, in a sentimental way; I rather like her as a person, and I hate to see anyone leading a lonely life.) But I hope that she doesn't just suddenly go "wow" and turn into an Amber clone. Someone with a balanced attitude, playing the comic's one sane woman, would be more interesting and plausible. And if she keeps some of the spiky attitude, any man (or woman) who catches her is going to have to be willing to put some work in, which would be fun to watch.

[Collarnorcrown]

I have a pretty healthy interest in sex and I'm pretty sure I'm asexual by MA3 standards... so people are probably gonna be checking Ruby's pulse. I concur completely though. One sane human being... relatively speaking in this mad house would be nice. Also provide a pleasant counter balance to Dillon, who seems to be getting kinda Flanderized as time's gone on.

Quote removed. The DAMNed

[John Callaghan]

Actually, British English has just about given up and accepted the US meaning of "fanny" these days. When I was growing up, we'd get American movies and TV which used the word, and there'd be a lot of schoolboy sniggering, but these days, I doubt that anyone much would bother to snigger. The word is hardly ever used for "pudenda" over here now that I hear; there's plenty of alternative slang terms for that, after all.

For the sake of balance, I'll say that no-one I know would use 'fanny' as 'backside'. What's changed is that they would now clarify afterwards whether they were using the British or American term, like a spoken footnote! I think 'fanny' is seen as a bit twee.

I'm given to understand that the editor of Ma3 is from the US, and so US spellings are used throughout. Perhaps this is true of such terms in SDB. In this instance, it doesn't make a difference to the strip really - although I'm sure that in a strip like this, sooner or later it will!

[Bambikles]

Everything revolves around sex with you, doesn't it ?

OUCH!


I don't know if it makes her the sane one, but she has a point
Sex is not everything, so will Ruby instill some elements of sentimental comedy ? I would like this a priori, but it depends of how it's done.
One hypothesis, beyond damage caused by Amber, is that Ruby is not against sex but has so high sentimental expectation that she never find any male up to them.
Hence, she has a sexual drive, maybe looks a porno here and there, but is not a seducer and never met Prince charming.

Suddenly I feel like being Monsieur de la Palice.

For the sake of balance, I'll say that no-one I know would use 'fanny' as 'backside'. What's changed is that they would now clarify afterwards whether they were using the British or American term, like a spoken footnote! I think 'fanny' is seen as a bit twee.

Oh my, fanny is almost completely innocuous in French.
It is used when you get zero point in a game of pétanque ("you are fanny"). Though it is from the habit of the losing guy having to kiss the butt of an ugly female picture called "Fanny". Only the word his still used today, though.

[Hogan]

She may look and sound prudish, but she DID watch at least one of her sister's movies, so... my vote is on repressed sexuality (to distance herself from her sister), but I'm looking forward to following this, most likely, bumpy ride

Did you miss the part where she accidentally put in one of Amber's movies?

My memory failed to remind me I'm afraid, and that COULD be where she'd seen said fanny up front and personal...

[Spidrift]

Sex is not everything, so will Ruby instill some elements of sentimental comedy ?

Problem; "sentimental" is a slippery word in English, means something very different to what it meant a couple of hundred years ago, and probably translates incredibly badly to and from French. As Wikipedia says, it "originally indicated the reliance on feelings as a guide to truth, but current usage defines it as an appeal to shallow, uncomplicated emotions at the expense of reason".

I'm not sure what a "sentimental comedy" ever meant, actually. I guess it's related to the idea of a "sentimental education" - an education for the sentiments, a process of emotional development - but there's no obvious English counterpart. We might have to raid German, as usual when this stuff gets serious, and call it a Bildungsroman.

One hypothesis, beyond damage caused by Amber, is that Ruby is not against sex but has so high sentimental expectation that she never find any male up to them.

The better word there might be "romantic". Possibly.

Suddenly I feel like being Monsieur de la Palice.

And that doesn't translate at all, and even Wikipedia doesn't help.

Did you miss the part where she accidentally put in one of Amber's movies?

My memory failed to remind me I'm afraid, and that COULD be where she'd seen said fanny up front and personal...

She hasn't been shown watching any of Amber's oeuvre in this comic. She fished one of the movies out of Gary's cardboard box, and boggled at the cover. Though I guess that cover may have featured a depiction of Amber's fanny. One of her fannies. Whatever.

(Irony; despite its obscene meaning at times, "Fanny" is a perfectly respectable female name/nickname in Britain, though it sounds a bit dated nowadays. I don't know how the much-respected First Aid Nursing Yeomanry felt about the slang meaning.)

Edited Addition: Random hypotheses: (1) Ruby used to really admire and respect her big sister (did someone already suggest that?), and so all the stuff about Amber being "perfect" isn't just sarcasm and sibling rivalry, but includes a really nasty sense of betrayal. (2) If you think Ruby has an attitude towards Amber, what are the odds that she regards Zii as the person who led Amber astray, and we'll see some real hostility if and when those two ever meet up in this comic?

[MoonshadowDark]

Twenty bucks says Ruby reveals that the only reason she hates her sister is because Amber hooked up with Zii, whom Ruby had a crush on in high school.

[Chantelune]

Hey now, Amber just asked Ruby if she likes women, not really talking about sex here. I'm starting to wonder if it's not Ruby who always relate everything her sister says to sex.

[Bambikles]

Sex is not everything, so will Ruby instill some elements of sentimental comedy ?

Problem; "sentimental" is a slippery word in English, means something very different to what it meant a couple of hundred years ago, and probably translates incredibly badly to and from French. As Wikipedia says, it "originally indicated the reliance on feelings as a guide to truth, but current usage defines it as an appeal to shallow, uncomplicated emotions at the expense of reason".

Oookay. I meant "romantic". Though "romantic" itself suffered decay across time.

One hypothesis, beyond damage caused by Amber, is that Ruby is not against sex but has so high sentimental expectation that she never find any male up to them.

The better word there might be "romantic". Possibly.

Ditto.

Suddenly I feel like being Monsieur de la Palice.

And that doesn't translate at all, and even Wikipedia doesn't help.

Huh ? Then here's the wiktionary: Lapalissade and Wikipedia's Jacques de la Palice page. I intended to use it as a synonym of Captain Obvious. I thought it would be easy to find. It was not. Sorry.

Edited Addition: Random hypotheses:
(1) Ruby used to really admire and respect her big sister (did someone already suggest that?), and so all the stuff about Amber being "perfect" isn't just sarcasm and sibling rivalry, but includes a really nasty sense of betrayal.
(2) If you think Ruby has an attitude towards Amber, what are the odds that she regards Zii as the person who led Amber astray, and we'll see some real hostility if and when those two ever meet up in this comic?

For (1) It's possible but I won't bet on it. Respect, probably, admire, I'm not so sure. How it's hinted, it seemed Amber was always the favourite, whatever she did. A cute, beautiful and charming, innocent-looking little girl turning into a beauty and still innocent-looking woman.*
I think there is evidently an element of broken pedestal, but I don't feel like Ruby being admirative of Amber. Even when only twelve, Ruby could perceive Amber as vain and superficial.

* I can't remember if some have akready discussed if Amber has an innocent look, and if that look played a role in her being the favourite and/or a successful pornstar.

For (2), I'm not even sure Ruby is aware of Zii's existence. And if she is, if she knows Zii's role in Amber's choice of career. Or if Ruby knows the details of Amber's choice.
I think the odds are low. Discovering some things doesn't automatically mean you'll like them. If Amber got in porn and stayed, Ruby may assume she enjoyed it (which she did). So Zii's role is marginal: she provided the spark, but if Amber had been made of concrete rather than of gunpowder, the spark wouldn't have had any efficiency and Amber wouldn't have ended in the porn industry. That is, loving sex doesn't automatically make you want to be a pornstar.

If Ruby believed Amber was kinda corrupted or "manipulated" into getting into porn, I think she would be less icy, less bitter, and more prone to interact kindly with Amber because she would think of her as a victim.

Though there is stile the "you let yourself get corrupted, how could you ?" thing. I dunno, despite what little we know of Ruby, I don't think it would be in character for her to blame someone for their perceived weakness. To me, her thought are rather "Amber is daddy's and mommy's hypocrite little girl".

Hey now, Amber just asked Ruby if she likes women, not really talking about sex here. I'm starting to wonder if it's not Ruby who always relate everything her sister says to sex

Good point. But for many people, talking about if you are straight, bi or gay is talking about sex. Blame the lack of mainstream romantic (i.e. love stories) bi and gay material (Right now I can only think of Brokeback Mountain).

This links with my previous question: did Ruby never had any boyfriend ? Or did she only had middle school/teenage romances with only making out and no sex ? Because there is quite a difference, mentally speaking, between "I had boyfriends, I just never slept with them" and "I never had any boyfriend".

[Spidrift]

Hey now, Amber just asked Ruby if she likes women, not really talking about sex here.

Sorry, but I assume that you're not being serious there. Apart from anything else, it was Amber who first used the word lesbian. Amber was talking about sexual desire, and they both knew it.

Suddenly I feel like being Monsieur de la Palice.

And that doesn't translate at all, and even Wikipedia doesn't help.

Huh ? Then here's the wiktionary: Lapalissade and Wikipedia's Jacques de la Palice page. I intended to use it as a synonym of Captain Obvious. I thought it would be easy to find. It was not. Sorry.

I found the "truism" meaning at the bottom of the relevant Wikipedia page, but as you didn't seem to be saying anything very obvious (certainly not by the standards of these boards), I didn't see how it could fit.

Edited Addition: Random hypotheses:
(1) Ruby used to really admire and respect her big sister (did someone already suggest that?), and so all the stuff about Amber being "perfect" isn't just sarcasm and sibling rivalry, but includes a really nasty sense of betrayal.
(2) If you think Ruby has an attitude towards Amber, what are the odds that she regards Zii as the person who led Amber astray, and we'll see some real hostility if and when those two ever meet up in this comic?

For (1) It's possible but I won't bet on it. Respect, probably, admire, I'm not so sure. How it's hinted, it seemed Amber was always the favourite, whatever she did. A cute, beautiful and charming, innocent-looking little girl turning into a beauty and still innocent-looking woman.
I think there is evidently an element of broken pedestal, but I don't feel like Ruby being admirative of Amber. Even when only twelve, Ruby could perceive Amber as vain and superficial.

It's just a vague possibility, but I don't see it as that unlikely. 12-year-olds can be quite susceptible, and very prone to hero worship. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if Ruby thought of Amber as her beautiful big sister - the sort of person she wanted to grow up like herself. If she was a bit vain, and if mummy and daddy were fond of her, so what? Beautiful big sisters have the right to know that they're beautiful, and the family should stick together.

Then came the discovery of the porn career - and remember that the problem there isn't just Amber's lifestyle choice, it's Ruby feeling obliged to sustain the lie, for years. She loves her parents, or respects them, or wants their approval - and Amber lumbered her with the choice of either lying to them or breaking their hearts. And all the while that Ruby was preserving Amber's lie, her parents were still talking about Amber as though she was the perfect big sister who Ruby used to believe in, but who Ruby now knows is a lie and a fake.

If this is even half-true, the best proof that Ruby is a good person is that she hasn't blown Amber's cover years ago.

For (2), I'm not even sure Ruby is aware of Zii's existence. And if she is, if she knows Zii's role in Amber's choice of career. Or if Ruby knows the details of Amber's choice.

We absolutely don't know. I'm just doodling with possibilities here. It just strikes me that if Ruby knows anything much about Zii, it'll be that she stands for many of the things that Ruby despises in Amber - but she isn't family, so Ruby would have no reason to cut her the slack she cuts Amber. They may well be complete strangers - though a kid sister would usually know her big sister's best friend by sight - but I wouldn't be terribly surprised if there wasn't an interesting meeting somewhere in the future there.

This links with my previous question: did Ruby never had any boyfriend ? Or did she only had middle school/teenage romances with only making out and no sex ? Because there is quite a difference, mentally speaking, between "I had boyfriends, I just never slept with them" and "I never had any boyfriend".

Again, we just don't know yet. If Ruby found out about Amber's porn career fairly early on, and if that was largely what put her off sex, then the odds are she's never taken an interest in boys - but there are just too many unknowns there. Fortunately, this conversation doesn't look complete yet, so hopefully we'll find out more on Friday. Perhaps we'll get a flashback scene to the catastrophic moment when Ruby found out about Amber's career.

[Artemisia]

Hey now, Amber just asked Ruby if she likes women, not really talking about sex here.

Sorry, but I assume that you're not being serious there. Apart from anything else, it was Amber who first used the word lesbian. Amber was talking about sexual desire, and they both knew it.

I presume that you know this from your immense psychic abilities to read the minds of cartoon characters?

My guess is that Amber may have thought one thing and Ruby another.

Of course, given that Ruby has seen quite a bit of her sister's sexual anatomy, now I have to really wonder if that had a major impact on her sexual interests...especially with other women.

[Chantelune]

I was being serious here. Amber asked Ruby if she had a boyfriend, it's not the same as asking if she have sex with someone. Ruby got all defensive, in the way that seem to implicate that men are the issue there, so Amber asked if she'd prefer women. Rereading this strip and the one before, I don't see Amber talking about sex here, only Ruby deciding that she was, especially when the conversation got openly about being lesbian.

And there are gay romance out there, but unlike straight one, you have to go look it out.

[Spidrift]

Amber didn't ask about Ruby having sex, but she not only asked whether Ruby had a boyfriend, she subsequently used the word "lesbian". I'd assume that any woman who had a boyfriend felt at least some sexual desire for men (or was a closet/denial case, faking that desire for social reasons), and I'd define "lesbian" as "a woman who feels sexual desire for other women". She wasn't talking about sexual activity, but she was talking about sexual desire.

Unless I've been using those words wrong for decades. How would you define them?

[Chantelune]

Well, call me a romantic but I think more of mutual attraction than just sexual desire. I don't deny that there are sexual desire, but to me love is more than just that and when I ask someone about having a boyfriend and such, sex is not the first thing that come to mind.

But eh, I'm someone who doesn't regard sex as something trivial or casual like it seems to be by most nowadays.

The conversation beetween Amber and Ruby might have come to sex, yes, but before Ruby's comment, I saw nothing indicating that she wanted to know about Ruby sex life, more about her love life. The two does not exclude each other, but I don't see them as the same thing.