[Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Are you looking for tips on how to get started as a comic/manga artist? Maybe you're looking for feedback on works you've already created. Then this is the forum for you! (Note: Ported from Gomanga.com)

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yesterdayshero
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[Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by yesterdayshero » Tue Apr 12, 2011 9:05 pm

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MrUnReady
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by MrUnReady » Wed Apr 13, 2011 1:42 am

>,>

<,<;

>_<;;;;

Link is gone~~~ <3 Silly blueyoshimenace ~~~ :B

Any you can point out would be awesome, but you know what would be even more awesome? If ppl would tell me how to go about fixing them. I pretty much know I need a lot to work on, but how to fix them is what I need the most. Please? D: Like, I pretty much know I need to work on anatomy or what ever, but which part of the body is not looking right to you so I can work on that more, not just work on the legs when all along I needed to work on the arms.... something like that? D: (I'm so taking this down with in a week. =v=a ) (I lied! I took it down today! 8D; )

Also, I would like to know if the story flowed right or what could have made it better.

Thank you so much to anyone who helps! I can only pay in muffins! D:
Last edited by SegwayNof on Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:52 am, edited 2 times in total.
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blueyoshimenace
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by blueyoshimenace » Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:27 am

MrUnReady wrote:>,>

<,<;

>_<;;;;

http://moonlitlivelove.thecomicseries.com/comics/1/

Any you can point out would be awesome, but you know what would be even more awesome? If ppl would tell me how to go about fixing them. I pretty much know I need a lot to work on, but how to fix them is what I need the most. Please? D: Like, I pretty much know I need to work on anatomy or what ever, but which part of the body is not looking right to you so I can work on that more, not just work on the legs when all along I needed to work on the arms.... something like that? D: (I'm so taking this down with in a week. =v=a )

Also, I would like to know if the story flowed right or what could have made it better.
You rely too heavily on tones. Make sure that your tones accent your art, and aren't just filler. Also you should try reading some anatomy books, and see how bones and muscles work

Thank you so much to anyone who helps! I can only pay in muffins! D:

laurbits
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Re: [Critique Corner] Moonlit Live Love

Post by laurbits » Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:07 am

Hi MrUnReady,

Your comic has a lot of strong points. You have a varied use of dynamic panels and you pull off some great contrasts with blacks, whites and toning variation. There's some nice visual effects throughout. While I'm not in love with the font you used for lettering, it's at least presentable and legible in the bubbles.

Here's a few suggestions to help you improve your craft. The number one and most important being: consider taking life drawing classes. There is probably nothing more important to comic artists than a careful study of how bodies look like and how to render them. From the cartooniest style to the hyper-realistic, I guarantee, anyone can benefit from it. If you find yourself unable to afford or sign up for classes, there are also some great online resources for them. The main issue I found in your work was a matter of proportions and consistency which can be resolved with study and practice.

Backgrounds were also a little lacking in the comic. Editors always point this out in their advice for artists: too many people don't do them because they're intimidated. But they really contribute much to the story. For one, they serve as establishing shots to ground your character in a believable world. As it is now, you provide some indication the characters are located in the park but don't show them. "Show, don't tell!" To get better at this, practice perspective and drawing from life. Draw everyday. Keep a sketchbook with you at all times and record the world around you.

I also suggest you look into using a different font for the comic just because the standard Arial doesn't have the polished look for a comic. http://blambot.com/ has a bunch of free fonts to choose from.

Lastly, also consider looking into the craft of writing. Study how to construct good stories. Right now, I get the gist of the idea but there are too many coincidences and confusing aspects that distract from the story you want to tell. Make sure to proofread your work before you send it out. I think you mean "should have" instead of "should of" in several instances in the comic. Doing both shows you care about the work and you want to present your best.

Good luck. I admire your willingness to hear about the improvements you need and I'm sure you'll go far with this positive attitude!

laurbits
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by laurbits » Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:11 am

Here's my entry, guys! Have at it. Would love to know what you think. :)

http://www.laurbits.com/comics/original ... nal-track/

Let's see. I'd pay you guys in virtual llamas but I doubt that would impress any respectable establishments you support. ^_~

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shutupadrian
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by shutupadrian » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:14 am

@MrUnReady
Apologies if this seems a little blunt. I'm trying to be quick about this. And as always, these are just my opinions. Opinions could be wrong.

General:
- Your pages are viewing at 405x600 pixels. They can be larger (I've seen many at around 960pixels in width). Your readers will appreciate not having to pull their faces closer to the monitor.
- I have trouble following the action from one panel to the next. At times, it seems disjointed and some moments would benefit from being extended.
- There are numerous grammatical and spelling errors throughout. Take the time to edit your text. Nothing reveals a creator to be an amateur more quickly than that.
- You seem to like drawing pretty and cute things. That's fine. Maybe this is just me, but also learn how to draw the gruesome, fearsome, terrible, and horrible. The pretty things will appear more beautiful by contrast.

Specifics:
Page 1: I think having a panel establishing what the scenario is here, would be helpful. I have no idea what's grabbing what in that first panel.
Page 4: The switch from very cartoony to photographic is jarring. Take the time to actually draw your environments especially in establishing shots. I know it's a pain. I hate drawing them too, but your comics will be all the better for it. (If for no better reason that it visually unifies the 'world' with the characters who inhabit it.)
Page 6: You probably mean to say 'Oof' or some such, and I catch your meaning, but 'hemp' is also a name for cannabis.
Page 7: "Could've" not "Could of"
Page 10: Show, don't tell. Your caption 'Note: Moon man..." is unnecessary.
Page 12: I have no idea what's going on. Sorry.
Page 13: "Dying" not "dyeing"
Page 14: "You're" not "Your." ('You are')
Page 16: DO NOT USE INTERNET ABBREVIATIONS IN SPEECH. (pet peeve of mine. sorry.) Seriously, it doesn't take up much more room to lay out "OH MY GOD!"

Okay, then. That's all I got.

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redprincess
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by redprincess » Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:23 am

When I showed my stuff to people I created a little survey with ratings so I'm going to use them on these, as long as people don't mind. 1 is complete utter amateur and 10 is professional.

To Mrunready

I have just read your story. I agree with you and laurbits that anatomy needs some work. If you can't afford classes or anatomy books I suggest (depending on your age) adult magazines. I have a stack of both male and female magazines to help practice drawing now and again. I get weird looks from some, although the lady at the adult store knows me and we go through looking for good composition. If you are not old enough try undie catalogs for both men and women. As for books I recommend Hogarth's Dynamic Anatomy. If you have a Borders nearby they have a few good anatomy books in bargain. (yay cheap!)

I really like your character designs and the outfits are super cute. :flower1: So lolita, it makes me want to try drawing your main heroine. XD I love cute things. I also like some of your pages layouts. They are creative and very manga like. (I have trouble with this)

I would, however, like to see more hand drawn backgrounds, and more detail in objects. I once read that backgrounds and objects should have as much effort in it as the people. They are part of your world, create it as you would create a character, give it personality and originality. Make it yours. :) I try a lot harder now, although it's still a pain in the tushy!

As far as the story goes I'm not sure exactly what is going on. I have a vague idea but I think the information is organize and the pace of the story confuses me. Also the ending doesn't end like a one shot. It feels like there is more to this story (but I love the look of the zipper head doc lol).
my Ratings for u:
Art: 5.5 You art does need work, but it looks like you did put effort into it, and with practice and some lessons I'm sure it will improve to a more professional standard, however right now it's a bit amateur.
Story: 5 I'm sure if I understood it the rating would be greater, and if it had a concluding conclusion it would be a near 10.
Character Design: 8.5 I just love your characters, your mascot could use some depth but the rest are fun and have recognizable looks.
Overall: 6.5 You are about in the middle. Still in need of work, but if you keep a good attitude and keep trying I'm sure in no time you will become a worthy rival of inspiring mangaka. :)



To Laurbits

I've looked over you comic as well. At first I couldn't read it due to the viewer, but I looked at the pictures (this is good to do on your own anyways to make sure you are telling a story with pictures as well as words, and for the most part it worked). After I found the links and read it. It was cute. Your comedy was mild and well placed. I do like your funny faces. lol.

As for the art, it's very nice. Very consistent and clean looking. The outfits are fun (especially the main dood--drake). I would've liked to see more black. In manga heavy toned stories tend to have think delicate lines, mostly shoujo. Your toning is fantastic but your lines felt a bit heavy in some pages, which felt more josei. I like your backgrounds, they gave a great sense of place, and your two page spreads....breathtaking! :luv: :luvu: I loved the concert one! One thing I did notice is the last few pages, when that lady caught her, those pages felt a bit rushed, as if you were reaching deadline and wanted to get it all in. The lines had a rougher feel, where as the first pages felt stronger and solid. (But I still love your BGs X3 nyu!)

I'm also wondering how much you know about music as well. Writing for a band is different than piano sheet music (which is what you have, and oddly looks a bit like when the saints go marching in, but I haven't played piano in a long time so I'm probably wrong, but those cords are oober amateur cords. lol) Anyways, writing for a band can go one of 3 ways, First they can write for each instrument which looks like that band has a drummer, bass (judging from the guitar's length) and vocal. Second way can be for guitar and vocal which usually shows the treble staff and cords (or tab), and the third could be vocals only, which sometimes is just treble, other it looks like regular piano sheet music with an extra treble and lyrics. Those are how seasoned writers usually write for bands.

Sorry about that, one of my biggest things is I over analyze and tend to emerge myself in as much knowledge for stories as possible. lol

A question about the story though, how did she know they were in love? And is this love like BL love or bromance? It's a bit confusing there. I'd also like to know how he passed away. I don't remember reading that. Or what made her the chosen one with that? I like how she gained a bit of self confidence at the end.

my Ratings for u:
Art: 9
Story: 7
Character Designs: 7 (Drake was very distinct, however the girl and the other guy were semi plain. If they were shown alone I wouldn't go "omg thats from that story" However, sometimes that is not what everyone goes for.
Overall: 8. I enjoyed this story. I did, but it left some questions i felt needed answers. :) Good job, I'm sure with some tweaking your next story should get a call back from Yen.

Welp, now that I spent two hours reading your stories and writing these, I hope they helped and sorry for typos and incoherence (it's 1:30a so I'm a tad tired). I will try to upload mine online so you can give me honest critique as well. :)

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blueyoshimenace
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by blueyoshimenace » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:39 am

http://blueyoshimenace.deviantart.com/gallery/28053161
go easy on me. like it says in the comments, my writer bailed on me and I had to write the last 17 pages on my own in one or two nights

MrUnReady
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by MrUnReady » Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:44 am

Thanks everyone for your help! ^_^I shall do some of the things you said for the most part. ^_^b (I'm taking it down now~ Got all the helped I needed/wanted. ) <3

Oh yeah! I'll have my payment up some time tomorrow....er... Today!
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blueyoshimenace
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by blueyoshimenace » Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:08 am

Anyone who is discouraged about their art shouldn't fret. Because we all improve. I know that all of you will be great artists soon. Speaking of which, chech out a comic I did four years ago!
http://www.freewebs.com/sikk/Doujinshi.htm

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redprincess
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by redprincess » Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:16 pm

MrUnReady wrote:Thanks everyone for your help! ^_^I shall do some of the things you said for the most part. ^_^b (I'm taking it down now~ Got all the helped I needed/wanted. ) <3

Oh yeah! I'll have my payment up some time tomorrow....er... Today!

Aww, don't take it down. I liked it. I wanted to ask if I could draw your main character. :flower1:

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redprincess
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by redprincess » Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:17 pm

Okay, after much resizing and uploading I have mine online. Phew! >.< Pain in the tushy!
Anyways I wanted to give a bit of a story for this. When Yen first mentioned in their magazine they were having a contest they gave no outlines what so ever, so I wrote and was half way through drawing it when they gave stipulations. Originally the story was 35 pages plus the splash page. it read japanese right to left with japanese sound FXs. They wanted it american left to right so I had to reedit those pages and rewrite the whole story to fit in 32 pages, (ditched the splash page for the submission but still had it so here it is) which made it a whole lot better, alot less predictable. Anyways, it took me 28 days to write, draw, ink, tone--complete this story. I was working as if I needed to make a monthly deadline. So yeh, anyways... here it is. Please give me honest feedback and I hope you enjoy it. :) Comic's are meant to be enjoyed by the audience.

http://akinomahou.thecomicseries.com/

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yesterdayshero
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by yesterdayshero » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:23 pm

redprincess wrote:Okay, after much resizing and uploading I have mine online. Phew! >.< Pain in the tushy!
Anyways I wanted to give a bit of a story for this. When Yen first mentioned in their magazine they were having a contest they gave no outlines what so ever, so I wrote and was half way through drawing it when they gave stipulations. Originally the story was 35 pages plus the splash page. it read japanese right to left with japanese sound FXs. They wanted it american left to right so I had to reedit those pages and rewrite the whole story to fit in 32 pages, (ditched the splash page for the submission but still had it so here it is) which made it a whole lot better, alot less predictable. Anyways, it took me 28 days to write, draw, ink, tone--complete this story. I was working as if I needed to make a monthly deadline. So yeh, anyways... here it is. Please give me honest feedback and I hope you enjoy it. :) Comic's are meant to be enjoyed by the audience.

http://akinomahou.thecomicseries.com/

Ok, here's my first crit (I started this thread, but I suck at critique so bear with me - -') The outfit is cute and you have good usage of blacks, but anatomy and backrounds are bit off here and there, I'm sure you're working on this, so it really don't have to tell you. The story flowed well, I like the start, it catched my interest but, I felt the flashback was too long, IMO you should have kept on with her in the forest, telling us as much details about the Animal Familiars, till she tries to capture the bunnies and the Forest King(cool design btw) starts attacking her, and maybe have him give us a bigger reason why he dislikes witches and who the antagonists are and what not. Maybe you should have made Domneic go with her... just to make things interesting dunno...that's my critique, dunno if it helps.... - -'

blueyoshimenace wrote:http://blueyoshimenace.deviantart.com/gallery/28053161
go easy on me. like it says in the comments, my writer bailed on me and I had to write the last 17 pages on my own in one or two nights
A solid work, they talked abit much but it worked out fine. The only thing that bugged me a bit is the art style but that's really just me, Lily was cute when she burbed lol
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StrateryB
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by StrateryB » Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:44 pm

laurbits wrote:Here's my entry, guys! Have at it. Would love to know what you think. :)

http://www.laurbits.com/comics/original ... nal-track/

Let's see. I'd pay you guys in virtual llamas but I doubt that would impress any respectable establishments you support. ^_~
One thing that bugged me was that although you did draw in subtle background, most of it was toned instead of actually fleshing it all out. It seems like you're too dependent on the tones. For example, pages 8-9,--I felt you could have done more there. It's recognizable as the interior of a car, but it's bland and looks pretty lazy. The tone doesn't make up for anything that's lacking there, it makes the pages look a rushed. You should pay a lot more attention to where the tones went because there where a few instances were I could see it chopped off without entirely covering the area it was supposed to.
Art is simple but cute. Anatomy is pretty good, but sometimes the heads look too big for the body. Page 12, panel 5 is a good example. I did notice another thing about page 12...in the first panel, is her foot supposed to be cut off there?
The character designs were pretty bland, the only one who was decently recognizable was Drake, but the other characters were too simplistic. Even if their physical appearance isn't the most unique, try designing clothes with a little more flare to stand out or maybe look up things in the latest fashion.

Story wise, some transitions were a bit off (like the scene from Cas&Drake outside suddenly to Mother Hen&Brian, seemed fast) and the beginning moved a little too fast. I think it got better towards the end (you got me with that twist about Drake and Brian, heh) but I didn't think the final page did much justice for the pages before it.
blueyoshimenace wrote:http://blueyoshimenace.deviantart.com/gallery/28053161
go easy on me. like it says in the comments, my writer bailed on me and I had to write the last 17 pages on my own in one or two nights
First off, I LOVED the art. You inked it very well and it looks great for something just black and white. The character designs were fun and each character was easily distinctive. The characters seemed pretty stiff, like on page 3, the largest panel and the last one for example. In the largest and first panel, her shoulders are uneven to the point where it's incredibly noticeable which makes her seem as if she's standing still, though she is evidently walking, but the shoulders are very distracting. In the last panel, her expression is somewhat vague (can't tell is she's hurt or surprised). Another example of the stiffness is the action scene near the end. Though it flowed very well and I could tell what was happening, her movement didn't seem to flow with it as well as it was supposed to.
The paneling was simple but got confusing at times. The second page is a good example. I understand that there were limited pages, but spacing out your panels more wouldn't hurt too bad.

The story seemed to get messy near the end and the final page wasn't a satisfactory ending but overall, I enjoyed your entry a lot.
redprincess wrote:Okay, after much resizing and uploading I have mine online. Phew! >.< Pain in the tushy!
Anyways I wanted to give a bit of a story for this. When Yen first mentioned in their magazine they were having a contest they gave no outlines what so ever, so I wrote and was half way through drawing it when they gave stipulations. Originally the story was 35 pages plus the splash page. it read japanese right to left with japanese sound FXs. They wanted it american left to right so I had to reedit those pages and rewrite the whole story to fit in 32 pages, (ditched the splash page for the submission but still had it so here it is) which made it a whole lot better, alot less predictable. Anyways, it took me 28 days to write, draw, ink, tone--complete this story. I was working as if I needed to make a monthly deadline. So yeh, anyways... here it is. Please give me honest feedback and I hope you enjoy it. :) Comic's are meant to be enjoyed by the audience.

http://akinomahou.thecomicseries.com/
Like yesterdayshero already stated, you are able to tell a story fairly well, but the background and anatomy needs work. I agree that the flashback dragged on way too long and left the fight between the girl and the Forest King very rushed. The King's decision was very random and seems almost careless, there wasn't much of a reason as to why he let her off so easily because her speech itself wasn't anything special or meaningful. The story was quite predictable overall, it feels super safe. I think you could have gone a little bolder and tried something less obvious.

Another thing I would like to advise against is using a Japanese title and Japanese SFX. If there's really no reason for doing it besides you think it would be cool or because manga does it (of course they do) then you really shouldn't do it. It doesn't make it any better and comes off as less professional.


But to everyone, I congratulate you on the fact that you were able to finish and submit. I think the fact that you finished a whole 30-page chapter should be something to be proud of (:
and I apologize if anything I said seems incoherent...so burned out by testing week.

so I'm going to go back to dying now

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redprincess
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Re: [Critique Corner] Everyone welcome

Post by redprincess » Wed Apr 13, 2011 9:59 pm

StrateryB wrote:
Like yesterdayshero already stated, you are able to tell a story fairly well, but the background and anatomy needs work. I agree that the flashback dragged on way too long and left the fight between the girl and the Forest King very rushed. The King's decision was very random and seems almost careless, there wasn't much of a reason as to why he let her off so easily because her speech itself wasn't anything special or meaningful. The story was quite predictable overall, it feels super safe. I think you could have gone a little bolder and tried something less obvious.

Another thing I would like to advise against is using a Japanese title and Japanese SFX. If there's really no reason for doing it besides you think it would be cool or because manga does it (of course they do) then you really shouldn't do it. It doesn't make it any better and comes off as less professional.


But to everyone, I congratulate you on the fact that you were able to finish and submit. I think the fact that you finished a whole 30-page chapter should be something to be proud of (:
and I apologize if anything I said seems incoherent...so burned out by testing week.

so I'm going to go back to dying now
Thank you for the honest feedback, I honestly felt the forest king scene was rushed, although in my original story that was longer it had more fight and it was a whole less obvious, but once Yen put a restriction on page count I had to find someplace to cut back. I never thought before the flashback was too long but now that you have mentioned it it does seem a bit lengthy for the stories size, I should've aimed to crop some there as well.

However, I don't use Japanese SFX because I think they are "cool" but I just love them so much more. I find you can be more artistic with them or subtle, not to mention they have so much more sounds than we do. I have tried to write with English sound FX before but it would not come out as I envision it and overall feel a bother to the frame.

:) Thanks again for your critique. I hope I can post other stories in the future and get the same useful feedback.

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