Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

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Fluffy
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Fluffy » Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:54 pm

Gotoh wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:17 pm
dmra wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 6:53 pm
And you're thinking of Nina as a kid with a stomach ache while Layla was suffering a real emergency
Because that's exactly what happened. Look at Layla's condition, more importantly, look at what was said about it. Now look at Nina's situation and tell me it's even remotely the same.
Regardless of the dietary requirements, there was a starving vampire - and Chloe, just as Brooke had done for Layla, offered up her neck to help a starving vampire. The fact that Nina fed on chocolate and not blood and her health was in no immediate danger doesn't take away the fact that Chloe was willing to put herself in a potentially dangerous situation to help someone she thought needed it.
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Gotoh » Thu Oct 04, 2018 8:34 pm

Fluffy wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:54 pm
The fact that Nina fed on chocolate and not blood and her health was in no immediate danger doesn't take away the fact that Chloe was willing to put herself in a potentially dangerous situation to help someone she thought needed it.
Finally. That's the key difference that dmra keeps glossing over. Layla was blood starved to the point of perspiration and being unsteady on her feet. Nina's condition wasn't dire at all, she was only hungry. The only other person to face a similar situation was Tiffany, because Layla was bloodlusted at that time. And Tiff's response was selfless and heroic.

What Chloe did was also selfless, I've repeatedly made that clear. But what she didn't do was save Nina's life, because she wasn't in danger. Layla was. Twice.
dmra wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:50 pm
And why didn't Brooke just take Layla to the school nurse?
Because Layla knows how eat and she had a willing donor. A nurse wasn't necessary.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Fluffy » Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:06 pm

Gotoh wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 8:34 pm
Fluffy wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:54 pm
The fact that Nina fed on chocolate and not blood and her health was in no immediate danger doesn't take away the fact that Chloe was willing to put herself in a potentially dangerous situation to help someone she thought needed it.
Finally. That's the key difference that dmra keeps glossing over. Layla was blood starved to the point of perspiration and being unsteady on her feet. Nina's condition wasn't dire at all, she was only hungry.
But what you're failing to acknowledge is that Chloe had no way of knowing how serious (or non serious) the situation was. All she knew was that there was a vampire, who was hungry and suffering. The only difference between Brooke's situation and Chloe's was what the vampire craved. The fact that Layla still had control over her senses enough to give instructions and such shows she wasn't on death's door. Weak, yes. Dying, no.
The only other person to face a similar situation was Tiffany, because Layla was bloodlusted at that time. And Tiff's response was selfless and heroic.
And who put Layla in that state? Oh, right - Faith. So she could show off, and almost got herself killed, as a result.

Incidentally, Tiffany's act was equal parts heroic and inherently stupid - considering she had no idea what Layla was going to do in her berserker state. All she knew was to get between Faith and Layla - so, she lucked out in how it turned out.
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by dmra » Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:08 pm

@Gotoh

Nina wasn't feeling blood starved because she doesn't eat blood. But she had skipped breakfast and was hungry. I'm not sure we know enough about vampire physiology to know how dangerous chocolate starvation might be but since that was all Nina ate it wasn't a stretch to imagine that she gets similar symptoms when she's hungry. And even if not she was still actively in pain and Chloe offered her blood to stop Nina's suffering.

According to you Layla was in deadly danger and on the verge of collapse, Two things about that. One it suggests to me that she might not have been in full control so Brooke was taking a big chance feeding her. Or have you forgotten what almost happened to Faith when Layla went into a blood frenzy. So somebody who knew what they were doing and wasn't liable to lose control might just have been a little bit useful. Somebody like say a nurse trained to deal with monsters.

Oh and despite what you were saying about Lalya being near to death or serious injury when we saw her about to feed from Brooke she was sufficiently compos mentis to remember about the school dress code and adjust Brooke's clothing accordingly and to have a coherent conversation about it. So perhaps Layla's need wasn't really that urgent and Brooke's gesture wasn't really all that noble as you seem to think.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Gotoh » Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:57 pm

Fluffy wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:06 pm
But what you're failing to acknowledge is that Chloe had no way of knowing how serious (or non serious) the situation was. All she knew was that there was a vampire, who was hungry and suffering.
If a friend told you they were hungry, would you automatically assume the worst?
Fluffy wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:06 pm
And who put Layla in that state? Oh, right - Faith. So she could show off, and almost got herself killed, as a result.
That's a different subject. Plus, every time "she" comes up I get blamed for it, so I'm moving on.
Fluffy wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:06 pm
Incidentally, Tiffany's act was equal parts heroic and inherently stupid - considering she had no idea what Layla was going to do in her berserker state. All she knew was to get between Faith and Layla - so, she lucked out in how it turned out.
They say that's the mark of a hero. And, yes, she was lucky.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by dmra » Thu Oct 04, 2018 10:10 pm

Gotoh wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:57 pm
Fluffy wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:06 pm
But what you're failing to acknowledge is that Chloe had no way of knowing how serious (or non serious) the situation was. All she knew was that there was a vampire, who was hungry and suffering.
If a friend told you they were hungry, would you automatically assume the worst?
Speaking of assuming the worst. You said earlier that you felt Kade was in no danger from Brooke and Quintessa since EC wasn't that kind of comic. Well on that basis what were the chances that a major character was going to die or suffer serious injury just because they needed blood while they were at school?

So since Layla wouldn't ever have been in real danger why was Brooke's sacrifice such a big deal for you when you didn't think her being willing to sacrifice Kade for Quintessa was anything to be concerned about?

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Gotoh » Thu Oct 04, 2018 10:53 pm

dmra wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 10:10 pm
Speaking of assuming the worst. You said earlier that you felt Kade was in no danger from Brooke and Quintessa since EC wasn't that kind of comic.

So since Layla wouldn't ever have been in real danger why was Brooke's sacrifice such a big deal for you when you didn't think her being willing to sacrifice Kade for Quintessa was anything to be concerned about?
Key differences again: 1.) Layla was said to be in dire straits, to the point of of being unsteady on her feet. Kade wasn't. 2.) We were told blood starvation is a serious condition for vampires. Quintessa never said anything about killing, or even harming Kade in any way. So based on the evidence shown and stated in the comic, it's clear only one of them was at risk.

Plus, we've seen soul swaps in EC reversed more than once.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Fluffy » Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:07 pm

Gotoh wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:57 pm
Fluffy wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:06 pm
But what you're failing to acknowledge is that Chloe had no way of knowing how serious (or non serious) the situation was. All she knew was that there was a vampire, who was hungry and suffering.
If a friend told you they were hungry, would you automatically assume the worst?
If my friend was a supernatural creature who needed to drink blood to survive? Yes, yes I would.

The level of starvation (or the desired sustenance) is a moot point; the fact is, all three stuck their necks out to help a friend in need at potential personal risk to their own well being.
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dmra
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by dmra » Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:11 pm

@ Gotoh
1) That comment was said by Nina who let's face it wasn't always the most reliable or perceptive of people. Or at least you didn't think she was when she was complaining about being in pain. After she said that Layla was able to take the time to find a seat, think about Brooke's clothing and talk with with her before starting feeding. Remind me again just how urgent and debilitating her condition was and how there was no time to get proper help.

2) Quintessa was planning to replace Kade's soul. Not exactly something that sounds either pleasant or risk free. You said you were OK with Brooke going along with the plan because nothing bad would happen to Kade because EC wasn't that kind of comic. But you also think Brooke did something heroic in saving Layla.

So either you're being inconsistent or you think EC was the kind of comic where replacing souls is harmless but being starved of blood will cause permanent damage or death to vampires.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Gotoh » Fri Oct 05, 2018 12:15 am

Fluffy wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:07 pm
If my friend was a supernatural creature who needed to drink blood to survive? Yes, yes I would.
So is Mel, yet Ace didn't assume she was dying just because she was hungry and neither would I, unless she showed signs of ailing health.
dmra wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:11 pm
1) That comment was said by Nina who let's face it wasn't always the most reliable or perceptive of people.
Except we had more than Nina's say-so, which is why I also said to look at Layla's condition.
dmra wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:11 pm
2) You said you were OK with Brooke going along with the plan because nothing bad would happen to Kade because EC wasn't that kind of comic. But you also think Brooke did something heroic in saving Layla.
I never said I was okay with what Brooke did, so I'm not sure why you keep insisting that I did. My argument has been that you're making a bigger deal out of it, than it actually was. The ritual was stopped, Kade wasn't harmed, so nothing really happened.

That's a stark contrast to the mess Chloe's made of Teddy's life, his parents, and Jacqui's (panels 2 and 3). Which is what lead to your repeat attempts to downplay it by claiming she's the same as Brooke. So I haven't been inconsistent in my position, rather, it seems you've forgotten what yours was.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by TtheLurker » Fri Oct 05, 2018 1:39 pm

The fact that people are passionately, and almost exclusively, discussing EC characters and events on a thread dedicated to DC speaks volumes about the quality of this comic and the amount of interest it generates in its readers.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Fluffy » Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:56 pm

TtheLurker wrote:
Fri Oct 05, 2018 1:39 pm
The fact that people are passionately, and almost exclusively, discussing EC characters and events on a thread dedicated to DC speaks volumes about the quality of this comic and the amount of interest it generates in its readers.
It's too bad Chloe isn't a more active part/the main focus in her own comic - discussions may focus more around her/her plot instead of diverging to characters/plots from the original series.
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Gotoh » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:19 pm

@Fluffy: Seriously. EC and MC both had a stronger emphasis on character and plot progression, the cast of both series were engaging and (with few exceptions) they were likeable. It was sad to hear to hear they got axed because they weren't as popular as Má3.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by Fluffy » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:51 pm

Gotoh wrote:
Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:19 pm
@Fluffy: Seriously. EC and MC both had a stronger emphasis on character and plot progression, the cast of both series were engaging and (with few exceptions) they were likeable. It was sad to hear to hear they got axed because they weren't as popular as Má3.
And this comic started out that same way. It was only at the conclusion of the Valentine's Day arc that it started to tank.
Please, don't come to me expecting me to fix your problems.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 1-10-18 Craving for Men

Post by dmra » Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:41 pm

Gotoh wrote:
Fri Oct 05, 2018 12:15 am


Except we had more than Nina's say-so, which is why I also said to look at Layla's condition.
Yes but then look at Layla's condition later when she was alone with Brooke. She's talking calmly and is showing no signs at all of distress. So again where was the urgency and where was the emergency. It looks to me like there was plenty of time to get proper help so nothing Brooke did was necessary.


"I never said I was okay with what Brooke did, so I'm not sure why you keep insisting that I did. My argument has been that you're making a bigger deal out of it, than it actually was. The ritual was stopped, Kade wasn't harmed, so nothing really happened."

You said that Brooke's actions didn't effect her character in your eyes because nothing came from them. IE it didn't matter to you that she had been extremely cavalier (to put it mildly) with the health and well being of one of her friends. So if you weren't OK with it you weren't thinking it was all that important either.

All I've been doing is arguing that this shows that Brooke isn't quite the paragon of virtue that you've made her out to be.


That's a stark contrast to the mess Chloe's made of Teddy's life, his parents, and Jacqui's (panels 2 and 3). Which is what lead to your repeat attempts to downplay it by claiming she's the same as Brooke. So I haven't been inconsistent in my position, rather, it seems you've forgotten what yours was.

I have never claimed that Chloe was exactly the same as Brooke.

What I have said is that your black and white view of them was wrong. And that was because I judged both Chloe and Brooke on their intentions while you think outcomes - however fortuitous - matter more than what people intended to do. Chloe never intended to split up the parents or warp Jacqui's development but Brooke definitely intended to help replace Kade's soul - as far as she knew permanently - and despite any potential adverse consequences.

Yet you think Chloe is a big sinner while as far as you're concerned Brooke gets a free pass because the ritual was interrupted.

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