Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

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Rosa
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Rosa » Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:28 pm

dmra wrote:
Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:10 pm
Vitocap wrote:
Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:55 pm
A community dedicated to a certain comic series, those who gather because they are fans and write positive messages about everything they like in the series, those who claim to be fans but obviously are not because they only write extremely aggressive negative comments against both the series and the fans who love it... yep, all the pieces in your description are here all right. :-bd
Well I wasn't going to do this again because you don't seem to be very responsive to questions but do you think just maybe. pretty please you could provide a single shred of evidence for any of the allegations you made in your last attack on me.

Because I have asked several times now and I'm sure you wouldn't want people to think you're making unjustified complaints against other posters on the forum.
@dmra, I don't know about your particular problem with Vitocap; I don't know how she angered you, how you angered her, who attacked who or even if that was really a thing, tho leaving fights between users aside I do remember a few times you attacked the comic and the author with very derogatory words and adjectives.

But if you want to talk about allegations and complaints, justified or not, I do have one. The user who signs @msaturn, who is your pal and part of your gang, called me a racist who sucks the dick of Dave Lumsdon and a creepy sycophant who laps up shit. I can assure you I am none of these things. And in light of that I think I am justified to complain. I guess you are now, of course, going to ask me to provide proof that I'm not the things your gangmate called me. Well, I'll save you some time and reply in advance: I cannot provide such proof. You'll have to take my word for it, or Dave's word, who can confirm that we don't have that kind of relationship. If you don't believe me, or Dave, then there's nothing more I can do.

I stick to the point I've been trying to make for some time now: trolling is bad, trolling is simple to describe and recognize (thx Vitocap for putting that in clearer terms than I could) and any time a dude comes to an online community of people who enjoy some thing and starts attacking again and again that thing (and/or those who like it) we gotta just call it trolling.
"I assume that the creative team does read the boards and that, through
the troll swill, they can find a decent thought-provoking post from time
to time. Other than money (of course), praise and intelligent discussion
concerning an artist's work has to be their life blood."

(by @worldshaking00)

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Rosa
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Rosa » Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:54 pm

DarkAsh wrote:
Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:41 pm
Dragon Paladin wrote:
Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:31 pm
So, out of curiosity, does any man find stereotypical accents sexy? Cause i just find them either laughable or annoying. If there was a stripper with a genuine Irish accent, yeah, that would be sexy. But a stripper who talked like Lucky the Leprechaun's even more stereotypical cousin would be laughed off the stage.
I’d find them to be more of a distraction, especially if done cringingly poor, but an authentic accent would be exotic and sexy. However, it would depend mostly on what is being said and only if it wasn’t cliched.
I've been wanting to reply to this but got swamped with the trolling debate. Here are my two cents: I feel accents can be CRAZY SEXY if I actually get to listen to them, like in a movie or a tv show. In printed media, meh, it does nothing for me.

Don't get me wrong. I mean: I have nothing against accents in books or comics - if authors wants to put people speaking in thick accents in their stories, that's fine and dandy by me. But it doesn't do any effect to me, for good or for bad.

I remember one movie I watched once, based on a novel I had read before. Most of the action took place in the Deep South, and the local characters were supposed to speak with a southern drawl "thick as molasses" in the writer's own words. And their dialogues were heavily accented, I guess to make it easier for the readers to picture it. Well, me, sadly, it didn't help me at all: I had trouble feeling it... and so when I got to watch the movie I was totally eager to finally hear those characters' voices talking the way they were supposed to!
And then it turned out everyone in the movie talked in standard "Movie English" with no drawls or accents at all. Darn. Don't you hate when this happens? :(
"I assume that the creative team does read the boards and that, through
the troll swill, they can find a decent thought-provoking post from time
to time. Other than money (of course), praise and intelligent discussion
concerning an artist's work has to be their life blood."

(by @worldshaking00)

─────────────────────────────────────────
http://image.ibb.co/jtqXqx/output.gif

dmra
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by dmra » Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:15 pm

Rosa wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:28 pm

@dmra, I don't know about your particular problem with Vitocap; I don't know how she angered you, how you angered her, who attacked who or even if that was really a thing, tho leaving fights between users aside I do remember a few times you attacked the comic and the author with very derogatory words and adjectives.

But if you want to talk about allegations and complaints, justified or not, I do have one. The user who signs @msaturn, who is your pal and part of your gang, called me a racist who sucks the dick of Dave Lumsdon and a creepy sycophant who laps up shit. I can assure you I am none of these things. And in light of that I think I am justified to complain. I guess you are now, of course, going to ask me to provide proof that I'm not the things your gangmate called me. Well, I'll save you some time and reply in advance: I cannot provide such proof. You'll have to take my word for it, or Dave's word, who can confirm that we don't have that kind of relationship. If you don't believe me, or Dave, then there's nothing more I can do.

I stick to the point I've been trying to make for some time now: trolling is bad, trolling is simple to describe and recognize (thx Vitocap for putting that in clearer terms than I could) and any time a dude comes to an online community of people who enjoy some thing and starts attacking again and again that thing (and/or those who like it) we gotta just call it trolling.
The issue between me and Vitocap is of course between me and her. I just wish that she'd respond in some way to my repeated requests to justify the attack she made on me. Because I don't want to think of her as a troll but I think we can all agree that making attacks on people which we can't or won't justify is a pretty trollish thing to do.

And speaking of attacks. If you were insulted of course you have a right to complain. What you don't have the right to do is assume that anybody who has insulted you is my "pal". I have no idea who msaturn is, I've never written a word to them and don't have any intention of doing so. If they were banned form the forum I wouldn't miss them or shed a single tear.


But you do raise an interesting point. I have no reason to ask Dave or anybody else associated with the comic about you, But you have several times taken it on yourself to speak up on his behalf about people like myself who you consider to be trolls. Like saying I have made "very derogatory" attacks on him.

Perhaps this whole matter of who or isn't trolling could be resolved by sending him or Jason a PM about any posts in particular of mine which you think have overstepped the mark. The he can read them and either let us know if he thinks what I'm saying is out of order or simply ban me if he prefers,

But the flip side of that is that if the answer is that what I'm posting is constructive criticism and he has no problem with it then you have to stop labelling me and people expressing similar points of view as "trolls" and accept that we have as much right to post here as anybody else.

How about it?

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Rosa
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Rosa » Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:03 pm

dmra wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:15 pm
Perhaps this whole matter of who or isn't trolling could be resolved by sending him or Jason a PM about any posts in particular of mine which you think have overstepped the mark. The he can read them and either let us know if he thinks what I'm saying is out of order or simply ban me if he prefers.
Already tried, about msaturn's messages. There was no answer, even tho it was an extreme case with colorful profanity (suck dick, lick shit, etc.)
You give it a try too if you want... but I suspect moderators have decided to leave us alone and not bother anymore. Like, we are on our own.

LATER EDIT:

Never mind the above; I got my answer after a couple of days. As it turns out, the mods have not forsaken us. :)

Thanks, Alex!

And goodbye, msaturn, nobody will miss you. :ymtongue:
dmra wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:15 pm
And speaking of attacks. If you were insulted of course you have a right to complain. What you don't have the right to do is assume that anybody who has insulted you is my "pal". I have no idea who msaturn is, I've never written a word to them and don't have any intention of doing so. If they were banned form the forum I wouldn't miss them or shed a single tear.
And yet I didn't see you rush to my defense when I was insulted...

But, of course, he's an enthusiast who shares your opinions (this comic is stupid, racist, etc. etc.) while I'm just someone on the opposing side, hm?
Last edited by Rosa on Tue Apr 10, 2018 8:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"I assume that the creative team does read the boards and that, through
the troll swill, they can find a decent thought-provoking post from time
to time. Other than money (of course), praise and intelligent discussion
concerning an artist's work has to be their life blood."

(by @worldshaking00)

─────────────────────────────────────────
http://image.ibb.co/jtqXqx/output.gif

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Vitocap
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Vitocap » Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:25 pm

Rosa wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:03 pm
dmra wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:15 pm
I have no idea who msaturn is, I've never written a word to them and don't have any intention of doing so. If they were banned form the forum I wouldn't miss them or shed a single tear.
And yet I didn't see you rush to my defense when I was insulted...
Heh.

You know what it is that I find, to quote FGF, pricelessly amusing?

We have so many people in this forum who pose as experts on trolling. We have so many people who jump on every chance to speechify about the differences between trolling and acceptable fault-finding, and will prattle on at great length to defend their endless condemnation of Dave's work as a perfectly legitimate expression of fandom.

And yet, the one time that a gross, disgusting, absolutely indefensible in-yer-face screaming troll rears his ugly head and insults Dave (and his fans) in a way that not even old Gorgias himself could vindicate, none of our resident experts in trolldom can find in themselves the resolve to utter a single word of censure.

The first offensive message by @msaturn was on the forum for twelve hours before FGF made a point of noticing it. Where were these worthies during this time? What were they doing? How come there wasn't even one reply denouncing @msaturn and calling him by the well-earned name of troll?

As a matter of fact, even after FGF raised the alarm, there wasn't any rush to chastise the nasty fellow. Instead of that, we got a flurry of replies attacking FGF, lambasting her for all sorts of vague and nebulous failings and shortcomings. The blatant troll @msaturn only received, almost as an afterthought, a few mild, indirect words of reproof -- and that when he wasn't simply overlooked.

And when @msaturn posted a second spurt of insults against Dave and the DC fandom (a message even more rude and offensive than the first) there wasn't even the pretense of a bark. These are the same people who, when someone expresses approval of the recent developments in the comic, fall over one another in their hurry to challenge the happy reader -- and flood the threads with angry tirades bashing the storyline. But here? A barefaced troll rages against Dave, and two days later we are still waiting for their reaction.

This state of things should be rightly called sad... except it's not, not anymore. The haters in the forum have pushed their contortion act to such a point of ridicule that it's impossible not to be amused by them.

I'm beginning to be of the opinion that we, the loyal fans who remain in the forum, should adopt a new policy when dealing with this crowd: don't try anymore to reason or teach or explain -- simply laugh at them and ignore them, with the confidence of knowing that Dave will continue writing the comic we love and enjoy just the way we love and enjoy it. :YMPEACE:
We, the old ghosts of Pizen Bluff, who still roam about this dead forum screaming imprecations at the characters and whatnot.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Fluffy » Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:32 pm

Gonna say this once - and only once.

1) I spoke to a moderator, myself; and yes, they are aware that the forums have gone down the proverbial tubes. Unfortunately, they're really busy with real life (which - understandably - always hold priority over forum childishness). When they get a chance, they'll look into things. In the meantime, it's up to us - ALL OF US - to act civilly. It's unfortunate, however, that civility seems to be one of those subjective terms as of recent threads.

2) We're not your bodyguards; thus, not obligated to come to your defense. It is up to you - and you alone - to report anyone who abuses/harasses you. If a moderator cannot get to your issue asap - instead of playing the helpless victim, praising the one person who came to your rescue while shaming/insulting those who didn't want to bother feeding an obvious troll (yes, Rosa - I saw your long rant before you edited it - even have a copy of it on hand), try adding the offending party to your foes list if they offend you that much.
Last edited by Fluffy on Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:41 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Please, don't come to me expecting me to fix your problems.

dmra
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by dmra » Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:33 pm

@rosa

On the rare occasions I've PM'd any of the creative team it's been Giz and she's normally quick to respond. Perhaps posting a message on FB might be more productive than a forum PM or reporting a post, Alternatively Jason has occasionally posted comments on the forum so perhaps talking to him direct might be more help.

On the msaturn thing don't mistake silence for approval. For what it's worth I've never seen you come to the defence of anybody on the forum that you don't agree with. Accusations have been made by people on "your side" about people being sexually repressed religious fundamentalists for instance without me seeing any comment from you that I remember. But that doesn't mean I think you're friends or part of a gang with the people making the attacks. Oh and I could be wrong and you've have defended people you disagree with and if so I'll happily apologise.

"he's an enthusiast who shares your opinions (this comic is stupid, racist, etc. etc.)"

There you go again putting words into people's mouths. I've criticised aspects of the comic but that doesn't mean I think it's stupid. I just object to some aspects of the story - things like Teddy's character changing dramatically at the same time as his gender or the near disappearance of Chloe until recently. As it happens there are quite a few things I do like about the comic and I've said so. If anything any negativity I've shown is because the comic has failed to live up to it's early promise while seeming to be more concerned with delivering fan service rather than plot or character development.

Not that there's' necessarily anything wrong with fan service but I'd much rather see more story lines like the Valentine's Day one with the fallout of Teddy literally going to Hell than Teddy having a series of basically random and pointless sexual encounters when he's supposed to really care about Chloe.

And I have never said this comic is racist. The nearest I came to anything like that was saying that it seemed odd that suddenly characters were speaking with accents when they hadn't really (with the exception of Gabrielle) been doing it before. Even on this thread I've commented on the fact that the accents are being assumed for some reason rather than the characters themselves being racist stereotypes by the creators. So the character's idea that an Irish person would say "Faith and begorrah" rather then the creators.

So perhaps you ought to look a bit more closely at what people are actually saying before you go making false accusations against them.

Zafnak
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Zafnak » Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:07 pm

Vitocap wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:25 pm
Rosa wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:03 pm
dmra wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:15 pm
I have no idea who msaturn is, I've never written a word to them and don't have any intention of doing so. If they were banned form the forum I wouldn't miss them or shed a single tear.
And yet I didn't see you rush to my defense when I was insulted...
Heh.

You know what it is that I find, to quote FGF, pricelessly amusing?

We have so many people in this forum who pose as experts on trolling. We have so many people who jump on every chance to speechify about the differences between trolling and acceptable fault-finding, and will prattle on at great length to defend their endless condemnation of Dave's work as a perfectly legitimate expression of fandom.

And yet, the one time that a gross, disgusting, absolutely indefensible in-yer-face screaming troll rears his ugly head and insults Dave (and his fans) in a way that not even old Gorgias himself could vindicate, none of our resident experts in trolldom can find in themselves the resolve to utter a single word of censure.

The first offensive message by @msaturn was on the forum for twelve hours before FGF made a point of noticing it. Where were these worthies during this time? What were they doing? How come there wasn't even one reply denouncing @msaturn and calling him by the well-earned name of troll?

As a matter of fact, even after FGF raised the alarm, there wasn't any rush to chastise the nasty fellow. Instead of that, we got a flurry of replies attacking FGF, lambasting her for all sorts of vague and nebulous failings and shortcomings. The blatant troll @msaturn only received, almost as an afterthought, a few mild, indirect words of reproof -- and that when he wasn't simply overlooked.

And when @msaturn posted a second spurt of insults against Dave and the DC fandom (a message even more rude and offensive than the first) there wasn't even the pretense of a bark. These are the same people who, when someone expresses approval of the recent developments in the comic, fall over one another in their hurry to challenge the happy reader -- and flood the threads with angry tirades bashing the storyline. But here? A barefaced troll rages against Dave, and two days later we are still waiting for their reaction.

This state of things should be rightly called sad... except it's not, not anymore. The haters in the forum have pushed their contortion act to such a point of ridicule that it's impossible not to be amused by them.

I'm beginning to be of the opinion that we, the loyal fans who remain in the forum, should adopt a new policy when dealing with this crowd: don't try anymore to reason or teach or explain -- simply laugh at them and ignore them, with the confidence of knowing that Dave will continue writing the comic we love and enjoy just the way we love and enjoy it. :YMPEACE:

I reported the post as soon as I read it. Does that count? :D

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Error of Logic
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Error of Logic » Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:35 pm

I'd say it does, and well done.

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sparky
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by sparky » Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:50 pm

This again? i-)
Any chance you guys can take the troll debate to PM so none of the rest of us has to scroll past it?

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Error of Logic
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Error of Logic » Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:53 pm

Perhaps we could set up a different thread?

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Post by Fluffy » Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:55 pm

I agree with the above two suggestions, completely! (the constant derailment is getting tiresome).
Please, don't come to me expecting me to fix your problems.

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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Vitocap » Wed Apr 04, 2018 10:41 pm

Rosa wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:54 pm
I remember one movie I watched once, based on a novel I had read before. Most of the action took place in the Deep South, and the local characters were supposed to speak with a southern drawl "thick as molasses" in the writer's own words. And their dialogues were heavily accented, I guess to make it easier for the readers to picture it. Well, me, sadly, it didn't help me at all: I had trouble feeling it... and so when I got to watch the movie I was totally eager to finally hear those characters' voices talking the way they were supposed to!
And then it turned out everyone in the movie talked in standard "Movie English" with no drawls or accents at all. Darn. Don't you hate when this happens?
I assume "Movie English" in America was a sort of neutral English they used at those times when they wanted to keep the locale vague -- that is, they didn't want to place the film in a specific setting with a dialect that was easy to identify?

In Britain, at one time, it was the same with "Oxford English" -- a style of spoken English completely free of accents, that nobody speaks anywhere. These days, characters in British films speak the way they are supposed to according to social and regional background. (It changes a lot depending on whether it's London, Liverpool, Manchester...)
We, the old ghosts of Pizen Bluff, who still roam about this dead forum screaming imprecations at the characters and whatnot.

dmra
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by dmra » Wed Apr 04, 2018 11:34 pm

I'm also happy for any future troll debate to go to a separate thread.

Fairy Glade's Fairy
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Re: Dangerously Chloe 2-04-18 Your Big Secret

Post by Fairy Glade's Fairy » Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:59 am

ROTFLMAO =))
OMFG I can't believe this...
I just poked some fun at that troll msaturn, and now look at the hullaballoo...
4 pages of fighting over whether the guy is a troll or not....
this forum is one of a kind...
:)) :)) :)) =)) =))

Vitocap wrote:
Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:25 pm
I'm beginning to be of the opinion that we, the loyal fans who remain in the forum, should adopt a new policy when dealing with this crowd: don't try anymore to reason or teach or explain -- simply laugh at them and ignore them, with the confidence of knowing that Dave will continue writing the comic we love and enjoy just the way we love and enjoy it. :YMPEACE:
oh oh I'm with you!
and also you just gave me a great idea!
I know how to show the forum our trust & support of Dave!
I know exactly what we need...
we need a really, really, REALLY big banner that reads: "DAVE MIT UNS!" :D



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