12-11-10 You'll never learn!

[sanzo]

Even aside from what Eris Lobo said about Ace's personality...

What do you think he could be doing to change back?

The orb's destroyed. He doesn't have another. He's a werewolf, not a wizard.

All he could do would be to go to someone who might be able to help - which he may have done, or the fact that he'd have to admit to the problem existing may have stopped him, or he may have been unable to, and plans to in the future (on the next school day, likely, since Professor Twigget would be the obvious choices to go to). Or option 1 and 3 both apply (he's gone to someone, will go to someone else, or back for a second try, later).

The orb wasn't destroyed. We saw Professor Twigget holding a shrunken orb after everyone in the building reverted.

As for Ace having gone for help to get Y-chromosomed up again, there's no indication of that so far. On the contrary, if he'd gone to Twigget (as you say, the obvious choice) since she has the orb he'd probably have been changed back by now. At the very least we've been given no in-comic reason for him not to have been changed back if he had, as you speculate, sought Twigget's help.

Does Puppy want to be a boy again? More likely than not, though we don't know how s/he'd feel after trying life as a girl for a while. Has s/he made any effort to change back? It doesn't look like it so far. At least we've seen no evidence that s/he has tried and there is circumstantial evidence that s/he has not.

I don't think Ace knows the orb still exists, since he wasn't there at the end. And since he's just now returning Nina's uniform, it's likely that he hasn't been back to school yet. It's probably safe to assume not much time has passed since the end of the last chapter

[Power_Pachyderms]

I don't think Ace knows the orb still exists, since he wasn't there at the end. And since he's just now returning Nina's uniform, it's likely that he hasn't been back to school yet. It's probably safe to assume not much time has passed since the end of the last chapter

Since the girls are there for a slumber party, wouldn't it be likely to be a Friday or Saturday?

[Kamino Neko]

The orb wasn't destroyed. We saw Professor Twigget holding a shrunken orb after everyone in the building reverted.

Notice that last sentence. 'Shrunken'. Meaning, it's lost most of its mass. Meaning, either destroyed or exhausted. Which, for Ace, is exactly the same thing.

At least we've seen no evidence that s/he has tried and there is circumstantial evidence that s/he has not.

No, we have no evidence, either way - we have evidence - proof, actually - that he didn't succeed, but that's not evidence that he didn't try.

Evidence that he didn't try would involve the orb actually being usable, and in the hands of someone who would use it for good.

[Lighthawk]

Notice that last sentence. 'Shrunken'. Meaning, it's lost most of its mass. Meaning, either destroyed or exhausted. Which, for Ace, is exactly the same thing.

That's kind of a baseless assumption. Considering we're talking about a magical device, the orb shrinking could literally mean anything. It could indeed be broken or out of magical juice, or it could have turned into a jawbreaker for all we know. And even if it's broken or out of gas, what says it can't be repaired or recharged? You can't really assume anything when dealing with magic.

All we know for sure about the fate of the orb is that is got smaller, and that Professor Twigget had possession of it last we saw. And it's up in the air as to whether she still has it. Maybe she does, or maybe it got turned over to the principal, or the local magical authorities if there are any, or it might have gotten returned to it's proper owner, whoever that might be.

[Kamino Neko]

That's kind of a baseless assumption.

No, it's not.

The orb, when it was held by Melissa, was the size of a volleyball.

It remained the same size throughout the entire arc.

Until the end, when, after a complete freakout, was the size of a gumball.

This would not happen without reason. The logical reasons are that it destroyed itself in the freakout, or it consumed itself in the freakout. Either way, it's out of commission. And, sure, it could be recharged if it just used up all its juice - but it's not going to happen immediately.

Considering we're talking about a magical device, the orb shrinking could literally mean anything

Sort of addressed in that last paragraph, but, no, it couldn't.

Not narratively, not in-universe.

In-universe, magic obviously has a ruleset - a strange ruleset, to lead to Nina - but one that's predictable, if you know the rules, allowing for classifications of magical artefacts, and Professor Twigget to analyse a situation logically and figure out what's going on. 'It could literally mean anything' doesn't work within that context.

Narratively, the shrinking has to mean something - specifically, in the context that it happens, with the established material before it, that it's spent, or burnt out.

Is it possible that there's some other meaning to it? Yeah, sure. Just not likely.

It it possible that there's no meaning at all? No. Giz and Dave are better writers than that. 'It's magic, it doesn't have to make sense' is a lazy writer's excuse for an asspull. Something random and weird happening in the background, or with something chaotic in nature? Perfectly fine - even required, in the latter case. Something random happening with the arc's chief macguffin, which is of an ordered nature? Nope.

[Lighthawk]

No, it's not.

The orb, when it was held by Melissa, was the size of a volleyball.

It remained the same size throughout the entire arc.

Until the end, when, after a complete freakout, was the size of a gumball.

This would not happen without reason. The logical reasons are that it destroyed itself in the freakout, or it consumed itself in the freakout. Either way, it's out of commission.

And you base that conclusion on...what? Yes the orb got smaller, but again, magic object here. I admit that there is some rational that can be used that it getting smaller could suggest that it used up all it's voodoo or burnt out, but until we get told that in the comic or by one of the writers, it's still only a visual suggestion, and easily open to all kinds of interpretation.

And, sure, it could be recharged if it just used up all its juice - but it's not going to happen immediately.

Probably not, I'd agree that there is a strong indication that Ace's current plight is going to be the basis for a story arc at least, and might easily last longer than that.

Sort of addressed in that last paragraph, but, no, it couldn't.

Not narratively, not in-universe.

In-universe, magic obviously has a ruleset - a strange ruleset, to lead to Nina - but one that's predictable, if you know the rules, allowing for classifications of magical artefacts, and Professor Twigget to analyse a situation logically and figure out what's going on. 'It could literally mean anything' doesn't work within that context.

In universe, you're right, it probably doesn't have that open door to any possibility. However whatever rules might govern this comic's magic system, we know almost nothing about. From our perspective, with our extremely limited knowledge, we simply lack enough data to do more than make wild guesses.

Narratively, the shrinking has to mean something - specifically, in the context that it happens, with the established material before it, that it's spent, or burnt out.

I agree with the first part, but the conclusion you draw based on that is nothing but guesswork. Now based on what we've seen of Ace's luck so far, odds are decent the orb isn't going to be any good to him, at least for a while, but that's hardly proof that the orb has been rendered powerless. It could just as easily be made useless to him by being placed somewhere out of reach.

Is it possible that there's some other meaning to it? Yeah, sure. Just not likely.

It it possible that there's no meaning at all? No. Giz and Dave are better writers than that. 'It's magic, it doesn't have to make sense' is a lazy writer's excuse for an asspull. Something random and weird happening in the background, or with something chaotic in nature? Perfectly fine - even required, in the latter case. Something random happening with the arc's chief macguffin, which is of an ordered nature? Nope.

This is a comic with a vampire that was born a chocolatarian because her birthday is easter, that's pretty random and she's a main character. It however works in the context of the comic, silly as it is. I'm not trying to suggest that Giz and Dave are taking the "magic doesn't need to make sense" route. Rather I'm saying that we are dealing with a system of magic that allows for some very weird things, and that we the readers know very little at all about the way this system works. Thus making assumptions on how that magic works is only that, an assumption. And in regards to the orb, assuming anything in regards to it's fate based on a single final image of it with no accompanying dialog is just silly.

[Makkabee]

The fact that the orb survived (albeit in shrunken form) strongly implies that it is still functional, though probably less powerful than it once was. It is possible that it is temporarily out of mojo, but there is as yet no textual evidence to support this.

We can for the moment dismiss the notion that the orb is no longer a factor in the story though because it did survive -- it's conventional to have such objects shatter when they're destroyed, and maintaining its shape while losing volume (we don't know about mass, but there's no indication yet that its mass is important) tells us that something magical is still happening to it. Chekhov's gun -- Giz and Dave made sure we'd see it, so they're almost certainly going to do SOMETHING with it -- even if that something is a failed attempt to restore Puppy's original gender.

[BobDole]

The orb was originally the size of a baseball, not a volley ball. In Blair's hands it might have looked like a volley ball, but in Mel's hands it looked about baseball sized.

[theodoric476]

For what it is worth the Orb cracked and the last we saw Twigit was studding the orb. Even if the orb is no longer fictional it does not matter. There might be others ways to get Ace back to male hood. Only Giz and Dave know and they can change their minds.

[Geeno]

Oh fergawdsakes people, there's a new comic out to change the "canon", move on people.
Nothing to see here, move along.

[Geeno]

Holy Sh!t, I killed the undying thread!
I need to change my user name to VanHelsing.

[Adamas]

*Rises again* GEEEEENNNNNOOOOOO

[Don Alexander]

*curses ye all for making me read through all that discussion*

I do believe, though, I have nothing more to contribute to this comic's discussion. On to the next thread...