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The cat ears are gone

RELEASE THE... rogue personality!

Wow, she sees herself as big.

Grreaaaat... so there's a 50-foot Laylamia inside her own head. What are they going to do... poke it in the foot?

Gotoh wrote:

Passing Through wrote:So what makes them think those statues and indeed, the kaiju, weren't there before Layla regained her memories? Who are they to decree what is and isn't 'rogue'?

You're forgetting Tia seems to be fairly knowledgeable about magic; particularly when it comes to switching things around. There's also the possibility she may be older than she appears. Either way, it's likely that she knows what she's talking about.

And Nina has grown up with her sister for all 14 years of her life. That's sufficient time to get to know someone, and she knew enough that the person they're dealing with now is no longer her sister - just as I and several others also noticed that Layla's personality was being taken over by Lamia's.

Passing Through wrote:That's the big problem here, even if Nina is entirely right, even if they could forcibly change Layla without leaving her a souless/mindless husk, that doesn't mean that Layla would want to go back to being as she was before.

Do you honestly think Layla would be okay with being overridden like this? This Layla? As in: "I will not kneel... not to Faith... not to you." I doubt it.

Exactly! The Layla personality would not want to be erased by the Lamia personality.

So yes, Layla would want Nina and Tia to take down Lamia.

Zippy wrote:

'J' wrote:I'm hoping that if they do actually reset Layla's personality, she at least gets to keep her memories.

I'm not sure that would be possible - the entire difference is that the Layla memories are being buried by the Lamia memories, after all. They either reverse the process and (re)bury the Lamia memories, or she stays Lamia-dominant given that red plasticine is only 16 parts in a thousand parts of blue. The closer the mix gets to finished, the less purple and more blue it looks.

yeah, that's what i've been thinking up till now: she's not layla or lamia; she's layla and lamia. it just so happens that there's a hell of a lot more of lamia then there is of layla.

however, given the dialogue on this page, it seems like that's not the way giz & dave are going with this. it seems like they're making a clear distinction between the two characters at two separate people.

of course, that's assuming tia actually knows what she's talking about.

Artemisia wrote:There's only one way to deal with a rogue personality like this...

what, you were expecting a quote?

Lock her in a small cell and never let her out!

http://coub.com/view/10wi3tw0

Gotoh wrote:And Nina has grown up with her sister for all 14 years of her life. That's sufficient time to get to know someone, and she knew enough that the person they're dealing with now is no longer her sister...

"Knowing enough" isn't the same as really knowing. Nina knows Layla in certain contexts - she doesn't know what she got up to with Kade on dates, for instance. If you sat Nina down and asked her twenty questions about Layla, how many do you think she would get right if they weren't narrowly focused on their interactions?

Gotoh wrote:Do you honestly think Layla would be okay with being overridden like this? This Layla? As in: "I will not kneel... not to Faith... not to you." I doubt it.

Well, look at her reactions in the immediate aftermath of her Quintessation. That was absolutely still Layla - the first serious hint otherwise in her behaviour was "oh, we don't kill humans any more, do we?" - she certainly seemed happy to be an ancient (and fabulous) vampire queen.

(And this is leaving aside that she DID, figuratively speaking, kneel to Faith, and the fact that she never e'en made any attempt to wreak revenge on her was effectively an admission that Faith could take her any time - the only actual aftermath of those events we saw was her hiding in her room in MC, EC time-skipped past any aftermath...)

jaimehlers wrote:

Passing Through wrote:It's true the resurection was only recently completed... but Layla was always the reincarnation of Lamia.

Yeah, it was only a matter of time before Layla decided to live her life in a way Nina happened not to like, this just happens to be more sudden than might otherwise have been expected.

Yeah, she's changing because she's ancient. Her innocence is gone, but the main difference is her sheer age.

That is not believable at all. Layla, through the entire comic, has been fiercely protective of Nina. Yet somehow, we're supposed to believe that after this 'resurrection' she would actually forget Nina's name, and airily dismiss having forgotten it as just being funny?

Has she been "fiercely protective of Nina" all the way through? I don't think she's been shown to be protective of her since the timeskip - she seemed faintly disinterested in the Nina/Ace date - or even before, with the whole "little big sister" and Nina/Dio thing.

(Leaving aside that Lamia-Layla seems to be actively trying to forget "unimportant" Layla stuff...)

CFT wrote:That's actually a major philosophical (and more recently scientific also) issue: is someone's personality (and identity) completely defined by their memories and experiences? And that question gets even more complicated in a fantasy settings where "souls" are proven to exist (though again, what exactly IS a soul without its memories? How can you define that concept?)

In this sort of fantasy setting, "soul" basically corresponds to what genotypes and phenotypes do in reality, except severable from the body (i.e., bodyswapping the spirit - soul+memories - results in no personality difference bar possible freakout at the situation). So, there's certainly a level of personality which exists independently of the memories, but that all gets filtered through major experiences... and a thousand years is a LOT of experiences.

'J' wrote:

Zippy wrote:

'J' wrote:I'm hoping that if they do actually reset Layla's personality, she at least gets to keep her memories.

I'm not sure that would be possible - the entire difference is that the Layla memories are being buried by the Lamia memories, after all. They either reverse the process and (re)bury the Lamia memories, or she stays Lamia-dominant given that red plasticine is only 16 parts in a thousand parts of blue. The closer the mix gets to finished, the less purple and more blue it looks.

yeah, that's what i've been thinking up till now: she's not layla or lamia; she's layla and lamia. it just so happens that there's a hell of a lot more of lamia then there is of layla.

however, given the dialogue on this page, it seems like that's not the way giz & dave are going with this. it seems like they're making a clear distinction between the two characters at two separate people.

of course, that's assuming tia actually knows what she's talking about.

Well, there's two things:
1) "Layla" was a partial Lamia. Whatever Lamia memories she had were buried beyond retrieval, and she may not even have been a complete soul.
2) The trigger for Lamialya trying to bury Layla-memories seems to have been "Ugh, I remember kissing dad. And mom!" It wasn't after that, and the anti-Blair teethbrushing, that we got a first sight of Lamiayla forgetting something Layla was completely aware of (not killing humans).

Now, Lamialya rejecting Layla's memories may cause them to coalesce into a "new" Layla in her mind, but that's a seperate story...

Zippy wrote:"Knowing enough" isn't the same as really knowing. Nina knows Layla in certain contexts - she doesn't know what she got up to with Kade on dates, for instance. If you sat Nina down and asked her twenty questions about Layla, how many do you think she would get right if they weren't narrowly focused on their interactions?

Knowing someone doesn't mean knowing every single detail about them, or their personal lives. Layla and Nina are only two years apart, they've been around each other for their entire lives. So yes, Nina knows her sister well enough to recognize that her personality was changing.

Zippy wrote:Well, look at her reactions in the immediate aftermath of her Quintessation. That was absolutely still Layla - the first serious hint otherwise in her behaviour was "oh, we don't kill humans any more, do we?" - she certainly seemed happy to be an ancient (and fabulous) vampire queen.

Which was prior to Lamia rearranging the furniture, as it were.

She may not have had a problem with finding out she was a queen in her previous existence, but I doubt she'd be fine with her consciousness being pushed to the side and stomped flat like Lamia's currently doing, so she can take over.

Zippy wrote:(And this is leaving aside that she DID, figuratively speaking, kneel to Faith, and the fact that she never e'en made any attempt to wreak revenge on her was effectively an admission that Faith could take her any time - the only actual aftermath of those events we saw was her hiding in her room in MC, EC time-skipped past any aftermath...)

Seek revenge how exactly?

Layla doesn't have any combat experience and she isn't interested in that sort of thing. Also, considering who she was facing at the time, I'd consider that to be an acceptable loss. Just as Faith being psychically b*tchsmacked by Hecate, was also an acceptable loss. In both scenario's, neither one had any chance of winning.

Simply put: there's always a bigger fish... but Layla's too proud to ever admit it.

Yea, as the story progressed Lamia has been slowly eliminating Layla's personality and replacing it with her own.

I highly doubt Layla is happy with that Zippy or with how Lamia how has been treating Nina. Which is the biggest tell that Layla is not herself, since she loves Nina.

Zippy wrote:Has she been "fiercely protective of Nina" all the way through? I don't think she's been shown to be protective of her since the timeskip - she seemed faintly disinterested in the Nina/Ace date - or even before, with the whole "little big sister" and Nina/Dio thing.

Speaking as an elder sibling here, there have been plenty of times I have wanted to bash my brothers over the head until they saw sense, and other such things, but if anyone had ever seriously tried to threaten or hurt them, I would have prevented it. Yes, that included getting in between two of them when they were having a serious argument that looked to spill over into a fight. And the fact that the authors have been downplaying Layla's tendency to defend Nina (which in large part is because Nina hasn't had to deal with any particularly bad situations recently; the closest one was when her and Tia were fighting over Blair) doesn't change the fact that it was extremely abnormal of her to outright forget her only sister's name.

Zippy wrote:(Leaving aside that Lamia-Layla seems to be actively trying to forget "unimportant" Layla stuff...)

I don't think we can leave this aside, certainly not now that we're inside Layla's mindscape and can see the way Lamia (yes, note that it is Lamia herself) is redecorating the place. To wit:

http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2014-06-14

That is not far from what's happening here. Someone without a lot of self-awareness is going to be extremely vulnerable to being 'remodeled', without even realizing it.

That last panel kind of reminds me of Ares destroying Athens in "God of War". I can even imagine Tia's narration: "Behold the mind of your sister at the mercy of cruel Lamia."

Also, really cute dress, Nina.

Even if they get rid of the rogue personality of Lamia ... is their a back up to the Layla personality? If no ... what damage or changes can we see for Lamia in the future?

Cortez wrote:

Gotoh wrote:

Passing Through wrote:So what makes them think those statues and indeed, the kaiju, weren't there before Layla regained her memories? Who are they to decree what is and isn't 'rogue'?

You're forgetting Tia seems to be fairly knowledgeable about magic; particularly when it comes to switching things around. There's also the possibility she may be older than she appears. Either way, it's likely that she knows what she's talking about.

And Nina has grown up with her sister for all 14 years of her life. That's sufficient time to get to know someone, and she knew enough that the person they're dealing with now is no longer her sister - just as I and several others also noticed that Layla's personality was being taken over by Lamia's.

Passing Through wrote:That's the big problem here, even if Nina is entirely right, even if they could forcibly change Layla without leaving her a souless/mindless husk, that doesn't mean that Layla would want to go back to being as she was before.

Do you honestly think Layla would be okay with being overridden like this? This Layla? As in: "I will not kneel... not to Faith... not to you." I doubt it.

Exactly! The Layla personality would not want to be erased by the Lamia personality.

So yes, Layla would want Nina and Tia to take down Lamia.

I need to see more to know what's going on. Yes Lamia is replacing Layla's memories, but it's possible that Layla's personality is distracted by Lamia's charms and doesn't know what's happening. Perhaps Lamia convinced her that she needs more power so that she will never be vulnerable to someone like Faith or Chloe. It's possible that part of Lamia is sweet talking Layla about what kind of power and prestige being her will bring and she's so blinded by it she doesn't know she's being dominated until it's too late.

Is it just me, or does Tia look a bit more mature in panel 2


Now, anyone waiting to see some mental shrine to her dead friend Tiffany somewhere?

vampire hunter D wrote:Is it just me, or does Tia look a bit more mature in panel 2

Yeah, I think it's some sort of "mental projection" thing. You know, why be a bratty kid when you can look like anyone.

She's a very subtle person when she thinks no one is around ;)